[Greenskar]

Quote:

Originally Posted by CLASSIFIED

Yeah, but Tony Stark is an alcholic and totally unrelieble.

Not only that, but the business climate in the DC universe is way more cut throat...

You've got Lexcorp, Queen Industries, Kord Industries, Stagg Industries, as well as others to contend with.

And who is Stark competing against? Osbourn and Hammer, two known criminals?

Of course he comes across as good when there is no competition.

Dude I am a bigger fan of Batman than I am Iron Man...but I'm not going to be irrational with my decision making.

I make business decisions not fan favorite ones. If you truly want to see a definitive Bruce Wayne wins hands down response, make the poll "who wins in a hand to hand fist fight, no armor, Bruce or Tony?

But Tony hasn't been an alcoholic for a long time. That gets thrown out anyway because it has no bearing on meeting production rates in a factory.

Tony Stark has little competition because he is the best inventor of defense weaponry on earth in the MU. Not his fault. The Iron Man armor alone trumps everyone else who claims otherwise.

[Snowflakian]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greenskar

Dude I am a bigger fan of Batman than I am Iron Man...but I'm not going to be irrational with my decision making.

I make business decisions not fan favorite ones. If you truly want to see a definitive Bruce Wayne wins hands down response, make the poll "who wins in a hand to hand fist fight, no armor, Bruce or Tony?

But Tony hasn't been an alcoholic for a long time. That gets thrown out anyway because it has no bearing on meeting production rates in a factory.

Tony Stark has little competition because he is the best inventor of defense weaponry on earth in the MU. Not his fault. The Iron Man armor alone trumps everyone else who claims otherwise.

Except he doesn't patent the armor to avoid people stealing it. Hence the entire armor wars that happened. Tony is arrogant even in business affairs which is his downfall, as well as his refusal to make military grade devices that can be turned into weapons.

He's not an alcoholic anymore, but he's also not an arms maker anymore either. Now, he makes cars and other eco friendly non-weapons capable platforms. The ironman armor is something he refuses to sell because of the implications of what it could become. This is why detroit steel exists in the first place, and why stane in the movie-verse had to steal it from stark.

Kind of funny though, you're a batman fan, arguing stark would win, I'm an ironman fan arguing bruce would win. xD

[Greenskar]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snowflakian

Except he doesn't patent the armor to avoid people stealing it. Hence the entire armor wars that happened. Tony is arrogant even in business affairs which is his downfall, as well as his refusal to make military grade devices that can be turned into weapons.

He's not an alcoholic anymore, but he's also not an arms maker anymore either. Now, he makes cars and other eco friendly non-weapons capable platforms. The ironman armor is something he refuses to sell because of the implications of what it could become. This is why detroit steel exists in the first place, and why stane in the movie-verse had to steal it from stark.

Kind of funny though, you're a batman fan, arguing stark would win, I'm an ironman fan arguing bruce would win. xD

Now there is a sound statement that would render this entire poll useless. And I agree with this statement.

However, I have to make the assumption that what you said cannot be taken into account on behalf of the OP's criteria for the poll. Which was that they are both bidding for a defense development program and therefore Tony must be in business.

[quinten182]

I'm looking at this as a pure 1v1 duel.. and Jason has this spot-on on the the first page. Iron Man would crush Batman as long as Stark wasn't smashed drunk.. and even then..

Iron Man's suit is just far superior to Batman's. He'd have a Batbuster suit ready to go and the talks of Batman being able to short-circuit it is laughable at best. Tony's new armor being hacked by Bruce Wayne? Not hardly..

[Jason Abbadon]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snowflakian

Except for one problem. He doesn't make weapons anymore. Only defensive measures that can't be used for offensive aggressive acts. That's Tony's current mantra. His Stark weapons can also be dismantled easily with a killswitch that he has designed into them for when they get out of hand. Something bruce could easily take advantage of.
.

Why would Wahyne "win" based on that? That's silly- you'd need to have extremis in you and an intimate knowledge of the Starktech to disable any of it.

Or be thousands of years ahead of earth in technology (Skruls or Kree for example).

Bruce is no inventor of anything- he's a guy that combines other people's technologies nad slaps a bat on them to make "Bat shark-repellant" or whatever.

As to making weapons, Bruce never made them (in the comics Bruce is pathologicaly opposed to making them), so comparing them on that basis is hardly worth doing. Wayne Corp seems mostly to do charity work...and Watne blows billions on nonsense- exceptionally poor decisins like constantly rebuilding the JLA satelite or the JLA moonbase or whatever- Stark wisely stablished the Maria Stark Foundation, run by a board of directors who handled finances, to finance the Avengers.

[Tiberius]

I love this thread so much, so many good points for both sides!

[CLASSIFIED]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greenskar

Dude I am a bigger fan of Batman than I am Iron Man...but I'm not going to be irrational with my decision making.

I make business decisions not fan favorite ones. If you truly want to see a definitive Bruce Wayne wins hands down response, make the poll "who wins in a hand to hand fist fight, no armor, Bruce or Tony?

But Tony hasn't been an alcoholic for a long time. That gets thrown out anyway because it has no bearing on meeting production rates in a factory.

Tony Stark has little competition because he is the best inventor of defense weaponry on earth in the MU. Not his fault. The Iron Man armor alone trumps everyone else who claims otherwise.

True, but you are looking at it from a purely business standpoint; Stark Industries is known for deffense, and Wayne Tech not neccesarily, and maybe for that reason the party in question's gut reaction would be to go with Tony, but there is so much more to storytelling than just that.

Competition makes you better and that is a fair point that shouldn't easily be dismissed.

Plus, Bruce is a master strategist willing to use everything in his arsenal in order to succeed. If he decides Tony is not going to get the contract, its not going to happen.

Tony's support system is weaker too. Pepper, Happy, and Rhodes would be no match for the gaggle of crime fighters at Batman's disposal.

Not all business is above the board and I'd bet Bruce would be willing to employ some pretty shady tactics in order to win the contract if he decided that is what needed to be done.

He has Oracle to hack into Stark's systems, Dick to spy on Stark's men, Drake to dig up dirt on Stark, and if all else fails; Batman to scare the shit out of someone.

[trebleshot]

Quote:

Originally Posted by bmorr

better hope its not a time bullet.

Don't we all?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snowflakian

Except for one problem. He doesn't make weapons anymore. Only defensive measures that can't be used for offensive aggressive acts. That's Tony's current mantra. His Stark weapons can also be dismantled easily with a killswitch that he has designed into them for when they get out of hand. Something bruce could easily take advantage of.

You're also assuming he would even know about the killswitch or how to access it. Why would he logically assume that Tony built a killswitch into his tech? Sure, he would try to find a way to stop it, but I doubt it would be as simple as that.

Quote:

Wayne wins based on that alone, and yes he is the better business man all around when you compare their companies. Tony is a tad arrogant with his futurist views, Bruce is more of a realist and adapts faster to incoming data while tony needs time to think to create a solution.

Bruce is no business man. He has other people run his company and acts as a figurehead. Sure, he may keep tabs on everything, but his focus is on being Batman and stopping crime, not running a multi-billion dollar corporation. I really doubt he would lead the charge to win another government contract, unless it had to do with national defense. Even then, it wouldn't be about making money.

And as mentioned earlier, public knowledge of his support of vigiliantism won't win him any favors when it comes to government contracts.

Quote:

On the batman ironman front, Ironman tries the screamer attack, bruce turns on sound dampeners in his belt from previous villians that have had similiar powers, or similiar heroes that he has preperations for if they went rogue. While tony would need to create a new device to deal with bruce, bruce would just adapt to what he had on hand to any occasion.

Why would Tony need to create anything special? His armor has a multitude of weapons and defensive systems that can handle almost any situation, including taking down a grown man wearing tights and a cape.

You're also assuming that Batman would be going into the battle with prior knowledge of his opponent. Ignoring that this thread is about a boardroom battle, no one said how the setup for a Batman/Iron Man fight would work. If they just met and had to fight, you're assuming Bruce's reaction time would be faster than Tony's.

If they had months to research and prepare, then Tony would have probably already designed contingency plans for dealing with Bruce, just as Bruce would have done for Tony. I do agree a pre-planned battle would take a lot longer and be more of a crap-shoot.

Quote:

Intelligence isn't always who can create the best new thing, but how you can apply what you do have. Short of the full on armory going after bats, tony doesn't stand a chance, and even with that, batman probably has a signal jammer that'd work with modulation to stop them. Same as he would probably be able to get a computer virus into starks system, possibly even a variation of the same polymorphic one that took down brother eye.

Unless Bruce got someone else to write it, I don't see how. Bruce is not a computer programmer or a hacker (unless there's been yet another retcon to his skills set). That's Oracle's territory. And who says Tony's current armor is even hackable? It's physically a part of him now, which means his mind plays a part in its defense. For all his faults, I'm pretty sure Tony made the armor inpenetrable to hackers and/or viruses (he just can't stop those pesky spam messages).

[CLASSIFIED]

I here what you're saying treble, but you're comming at it like its just Bruce and Tony but it wouldn't be just those two.

Bruce may be the "figurehead" of Waynetech, but believe me, he's the figurehead in name only. He only pretends to be the figurehead, Batman controls everything.

And he doesn't need to prepare, he anticipates every contingency whether he knows who he's going up against or not.

Like I said in my post; his support system is fair game as well, so your argument that Oracle knows computers and he doesn't is null and void.

[Greenskar]

Quote:

Originally Posted by CLASSIFIED

True, but you are looking at it from a purely business standpoint; Stark Industries is known for deffense, and Wayne Tech not neccesarily, and maybe for that reason the party in question's gut reaction would be to go with Tony, but there is so much more to storytelling than just that.

Umm...this needs to be looked at from a business standpoint. You created a poll about who wins a bid for a big contract.

Quote:

Originally Posted by CLASSIFIED

Competition makes you better and that is a fair point that shouldn't easily be dismissed.

Plus, Bruce is a master strategist willing to use everything in his arsenal in order to succeed. If he decides Tony is not going to get the contract, its not going to happen.

Tony's support system is weaker too. Pepper, Happy, and Rhodes would be no match for the gaggle of crime fighters at Batman's disposal.

Not all business is above the board and I'd bet Bruce would be willing to employ some pretty shady tactics in order to win the contract if he decided that is what needed to be done.

He has Oracle to hack into Stark's systems, Dick to spy on Stark's men, Drake to dig up dirt on Stark, and if all else fails; Batman to scare the shit out of someone.

Now you're giving me the same line (in between the lines) that made me hate Batman for years in my early 20's browsing the message boards... "He'll win, because He's THE BATMAN".

EFF THAT.

TECHNOLOGY

Bruce's Wayne Industries creates gadgets which help Batman to be the terror of smalltime crooks and lunatics all over Gotham. He's produced suits of armor before, none of which can even come within spitting distance of the power levels of DC's top dawgs.

Stark Industries creates Gadgets that make the Iron Man one of the single most powerful superheroes in the Marvel Universe. They turn Iron Man into terror for cosmic beings. Somebody who can go toe to toe with the likes of Thor, and Incredible Hulk. And maybe, just maybe with a bit of strategic thinking, actually win.

Iron Man only just barely missed making it into the top ten most powerful heroes of all time list done some years back. That says everything you need to know about the difference in technological advancement between Stark industries and Wayne Enterprises.

FINANCES

Wayne Enterprises funds charities, civic services, and batman's low-to-mid scale(Compared to Iron Man's at least) technology.

Stark Enterprises funds charities, Iron Man's massively superior up to date technology, multiple specialized varieties of his own primary armor including War Machine, and Hulkbuster suits, the creation of hundreds of Gaurdian knock-off armors(Batman's best suit of armor is about equal to a single suit of Gaurdian Armor), dozens of old and now obsolete Armor designs, AND he Funds the Avengers.

POLITICAL INFLUENCE

Wayne Enterprises is almost exclusively centered and focused in Gotham. While it fills many government contracts, it's just one corporation amongst many who does so.

Stark Enterprises is, and has for a long time been deeply connected in the government. Stark has supplied them with many weapons and technologies, and has worked very intimately with the government in both his identities. He has many levels of security clearance. And again...was also the Secretary of Defense at one point.

Is there really any question who has superior political influence?

Bruce's only advantage is that strategically he's smarter. But not by a large enough margin to cancel out Tony's technological, political, and financial advantages. Bruce has a small headstart in Strategic Brains, but tony has a huge headstart in the other three categories.

Tony's battle with the bottle is resolved for the most part. As resolved as such a battle can ever be. It doesn't enter into this. If anything it's made him a stronger man for this competitive bid.

Even Experience-wise Tony has the advantage. Very few, if any Batman storylines have ever focused on a corporate battle. Only one in fact, which I dont beleive they ever even resolved adequately if I remember correctly. He's so pathologically obsessed with being Batman he leaves Wayne Enterprises almost exclusively in Lucius Fox's hands. It's ironic really. He could do more good as Bruce Wayne than he ever could as Batman, but he's too blinded by his obsession to realize that.

Tony Stark has a VERY active hand in Stark Industries. He understands the power he has as Tony Stark is in many ways far greater than the power he has as Iron Man, and he puts it to use every single day. He's had more than a few corporate take over storylines in his day.

But Bruce will take this, because he's Batman.

*Sigh* It's not your fault Bruce, much love Homie.

[rustyrob]

Quote:

Originally Posted by xhavoc86

Bruce Wayne, hands down. Ironman's a douche, especially ever since Robert Downey Jr played him.

what he said^^^

Batman has a way to defeat all members of the justice league so who here does not think he can find away to destroy ironman...
And wasnt cap handing ironman his azz at the end of CivilWar before giving up?
Wasnt batman about to beat Cap in Marvel vs DC? (lol i dont know how serious ppl will take that comment)
Didnt batman create the OMACs?
Didnt he invent the Beyond suit?

i think he can handle a drunk in a suit IMHO

[Tiberius]

I disagree to disagree.

[behindthemask]

Ok here's your definative answer, screw the team up thing lets say this is straight vs 1 on 1, no villian, no girl to save, no city on fire, nothing. Comicbook fightclub, there's 1 clear answer but 2 scenarios.

1 is no suits, just man vs man, Bruce wayne wins, as he's been trained to be a ninja, a member of the darkshadows. Where as tony was a rich kid his whole life and only became a badass when he was locked in a cave and about to die lol.

2 add the suits and Tony wins, he has spacegrade metal covering him head to toe, no bat-a-rang or grappling hook is going to save him, unless he builds his own suits he's dead. He'll break his bones trying to break the suit down and when he's weak tony will fire a pencil sized missle and kill him for good, or do what he did in the end of IM2 and use that wrist lazer flame thing lol.

[Greenskar]

Did anyone besides me and classified read the original post?


I'm only continuing this because Classified is still sticking to the original poll argument and while we disagree with the outcome he's at least making worthwhile arguments.

[Jason Abbadon]

In any business venture Tony clearly wins- anyone that's gone from millionaire to multi-millionaire to broke as a joke to billionaire clearly knows how to make money and take a business from nothing to global powerhouse.

Wayne was always crazy rich and it's only Lucius Fox that keeps Wayne from flipping burgers as a day job after the billions he's pissed away on JLA satelites, JLA moonbases, JLA money shredders, Brother Eye and countless Batjets, Batmobiles, Bat Shark-Repellant and Robin funerals.

A real test would be Stark vs. Fox.

[Greenskar]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jason Abbadon

In any business venture Tony clearly wins- anyone that's gone from millionaire to multi-millionaire to broke as a joke to billionaire clearly knows how to make money and take a business from nothing to global powerhouse.

Wayne was always crazy rich and it's only Lucius Fox that keeps Wayne from flipping burgers as a day job after the billions he's pissed away on JLA satelites, JLA moonbases, JLA money shredders, Brother Eye and countless Batjets, Batmobiles, Bat Shark-Repellant and Robin funerals.

A real test would be Stark vs. Fox.

I wouldn't say any business venture. But if it has to do with a defense contract or technology, then yeah I tip my hat to Stark.

Also, everyone who keeps making Batman arguments keeps forgetting one simple thing...The Government actually knows Stark is Iron Man. Who knows Bruce Wayne is Batman? All his gadgets as Batman are irrelevant because know one knows he has anything to do with them for this business contract.

If you wanted to make a bid for a defense contract an actual competition, it still wouldn't be Fox. A better battle for this type of discussion would be:

Tony Stark vs. Oliver Queen

That would be a much better contest IMO as far as defense goes.

[CLASSIFIED]

@Greenskar

I think you are deliberately underselling Wayne Tech's and Batman's achievements in the business world/ ability to produce technology and overselling Stark in order to make your point.

Realistically, the outcome would be determined by whomever tells the story.

Wayne Tech and Stark Industries both make bids on a defense contract for a friendly country who is in imminent danger and whose protection is of vital importance to the world at large.

The country in question of course goes with Stark at the outset because of his obvious experience in the field, but Bruce doesn't trust Stark and won't go down without a fight.

Oracle hacks into Stark's systems in order to sabotage his efforts publicly so that the country will change its mind.

Cassandra Cain breaks into Stark Industries in order to steal Stark's tech and give Batman an edge.

Nightwing confronts Pepper in order to convince her Wayne Tech should get the contract for the greater good.

Bruce takes the leader of the country out and shows him a good time in an attempt to schmooze him.

Batman breaks into Stark's penthouse and tries to scare him into backing out; this is where the obligatory fight between Batman and Iron Man takes place.

At this point Bruce probably figures out that Iron Man and Stark are one and the same, but it doesn't matter, the country has decided to go with a joint bid submitted by Lexcorp and Oscorp, possibly because of Bruce and Tony's back and forth.

Batman and Iron Man team up to smash Luthor and Osborn. Wayne Tech gets the contract, but Stark Industries builds the actually defensive technology the country will use to protect itself.

Sometimes in the world of business, it isn't who offers the better actual product, but the business man who makes the better pitch. Bruce is a master manipulator, and while Stark may build better technology, Bruce is more persuasive.

[Crazy Jetty]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greenskar

A better battle for this type of discussion would be:

Tony Stark vs. Oliver Queen

That would be a much better contest IMO as far as defense goes.

No challenge. While you're vastly underselling Bruce, Batman, and Waynetech, you're now overselling Ollie. He's a terrible CEO. After running Queen Industries into the ground, he lost his company.
Unlike Bruce, he couldn't balance Family Man Ollie, Public Facade Playboy Billionare Ollie, Humanitarian Ollie, CEO Ollie, and secret vigilante Green Arrow.
He's basically so bad at it that he's lost his company, he lost his city, he lost his fortune, he lost his secret identity, he lost his wife, he lost his son, and he lost his daughter.

So no challenge there. Stark wins.

[omega145]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greenskar

Did anyone besides me and classified read the original post?

I sure did and even mentioned that people were posting from a one on fight standpoint as opposed to the business contracts that was brought up in the first post. Then again it seems like most people here dont read entire threads anymore....

[quipp209]

Batman one of the bada$$ hero without powers tony stark the same but he has powers without a doubt in my mind iron man would easily defeat Batman what could Batman really do to iron man's bleeding edge armor lmao nothing starks technology is far more advanced then anyone in the whole dc universe lol iron man hands down n it won't even take long ( that's what she said)

[quipp209]

N I think we all.read what the thread was about but who cares who can buy who out lol we all wanna c a fight

[hrothgars]

I remember this image made the top 25 on reddit a few days ago:

[Mastersteef]

Quote:

Originally Posted by CLASSIFIED

@Greenskar

I think you are deliberately underselling Wayne Tech's and Batman's achievements in the business world/ ability to produce technology and overselling Stark in order to make your point.

Realistically, the outcome would be determined by whomever tells the story.

Wayne Tech and Stark Industries both make bids on a defense contract for a friendly country who is in imminent danger and whose protection is of vital importance to the world at large.

The country in question of course goes with Stark at the outset because of his obvious experience in the field, but Bruce doesn't trust Stark and won't go down without a fight.

Oracle hacks into Stark's systems in order to sabotage his efforts publicly so that the country will change its mind.

Cassandra Cain breaks into Stark Industries in order to steal Stark's tech and give Batman an edge.

Nightwing confronts Pepper in order to convince her Wayne Tech should get the contract for the greater good.

Bruce takes the leader of the country out and shows him a good time in an attempt to schmooze him.

Batman breaks into Stark's penthouse and tries to scare him into backing out; this is where the obligatory fight between Batman and Iron Man takes place.

At this point Bruce probably figures out that Iron Man and Stark are one and the same, but it doesn't matter, the country has decided to go with a joint bid submitted by Lexcorp and Oscorp, possibly because of Bruce and Tony's back and forth.

Batman and Iron Man team up to smash Luthor and Osborn. Wayne Tech gets the contract, but Stark Industries builds the actually defensive technology the country will use to protect itself.

Sometimes in the world of business, it isn't who offers the better actual product, but the business man who makes the better pitch. Bruce is a master manipulator, and while Stark may build better technology, Bruce is more persuasive.

Ladies and gentlemen, this ^ is what happens when an extremely intelligent man gives into "nerd rage"....isn't it glorious?

[hrothgars]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jason Abbadon

...and if Bruce had the IM2.0 (War Machine's current suit) Gotham would be crime free in days!

OMG, War Machine Batman would be tits.

In general, I am leaning toward Bruce. Tony is more innovative. One thing that makes Dick Grayson & Tim Drake so interesting in the books is that they use innovative solutions that Bruce wouldn't use for one reason or another.

Bruce is more strategic. He has a contingency plan for everything, and everybody.

So Bruce would have an advantage going in, but Tony might pull some spur of the moment move out of his arsenal and throw Bruce for a loop.

Either way, I would want to have a front row seat.

If I was handicapping, I would give Bruce 7:5 odds (a $10 bet would win you $14). Tony would get 5:2 (a $10 bet would win you $25).

[CLASSIFIED]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crazy Jetty

No challenge. While you're vastly underselling Bruce, Batman, and Waynetech, you're now overselling Ollie. He's a terrible CEO. After running Queen Industries into the ground, he lost his company.
Unlike Bruce, he couldn't balance Family Man Ollie, Public Facade Playboy Billionare Ollie, Humanitarian Ollie, CEO Ollie, and secret vigilante Green Arrow.
He's basically so bad at it that he's lost his company, he lost his city, he lost his fortune, he lost his secret identity, he lost his wife, he lost his son, and he lost his daughter.

So no challenge there. Stark wins.

I agree with Jetty even though he's Crazy, Stark would go over Ollie, even if Ollie had an anti-Iron Man arrow in his quiver.

Quote:

Originally Posted by omega145

I sure did and even mentioned that people were posting from a one on fight standpoint as opposed to the business contracts that was brought up in the first post. Then again it seems like most people here dont read entire threads anymore....

Omega speaks the truth.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mastersteef

Ladies and gentlemen, this ^ is what happens when an extremely intelligent man gives into "nerd rage"....isn't it glorious?

Thanks, I think?