[1987olds442]

[Barefootabe]

nice pic!

[Dr Kain]

Quote:

Originally Posted by CMIII

Dr. Kain Seriously aside from you I have never heard any one ask for Talia or Ra's. To say they have done nothing is like saying that the sky does nothing when it rains. There have been good figures I am sorry that every wave wasn't 5 - 8 versions of Batman heroes and villains but there are other characters like it or not. I'd like to see Merlyn, Bizarro, Indigo-1, Oversized Doomsday and Killer Croc but I am not going to be overly annoyed if I do not get them, Patients is a Virtue

Given that Ras is only the most important villain in Batman's entire rogues gallery, I highly doubt that. Same with Talia, who is Bruce's true love and the mother of his son.

I don't expect just Batman villains, but I am tired of Mattel giving us the finger when it comes to questions, accessories, quality control, etc. Except for Phantom Stranger, I have not received a single figure that did not have some type of issue in the sub this year. And then you have figures like Flash, who cost $32 after shipping, who come with absolutely NO accessories. How does Mattel respond? They either just ignore us or make up some bullshit answer and have an elitist attitude in the process. Have you looked at their Matty forums? The Ask Matty DCU section has had maybe 5 questions answered in almost a year.

I also want an over sized Doomsday, Killer Croc, and Merlyn. But I also want Vandal Savage, The Shade, the Fatal Five, El Papagayo, Turnbull, Bat Lash, El Diablo, Cinnamon, Anton Arcane, Abigail Arcane, Granny Goodness, Glorious Godfrey, Dr Light (Both), High Father, Ocean Master, the Flouronic Man, Shadow Lass, Triplicate Girl, Mon-El, and many others.

However, Mattel seems to care more about giving us whatever is cheap and easy to do even though they continue to raise their prices with nothing for us to show for it. If anything, they could at least package a god damned stand with each character in the sub. THey are just sucking the enjoyment and fun out of collecting this line, leaving me with only collecting it just because I feel the need to since I have almost every figure released thus far. That is exactly the reason I got out of MOTUC and have been selling my collection off in spurts.

[1987olds442]

Quote:

Originally Posted by CMIII

Dr. Kain Seriously aside from you I have never heard any one ask for Talia or Ra's.

Dude those two are on most people's top 10 most wanted figures.

[trebleshot]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr Kain

Given that Ras is only the most important villain in Batman's entire rogues gallery, I highly doubt that.

I very strongly disagree with your opinion. In my mind, no one tops the Joker, as far as Batman villains are concerned. In fact, the Joker has about 31 years of comic history (531 appearances since 1940) over Ra's Al Ghul (160 appearances since 1971). So you will never convince me that Ra's is more important as a Batman villain. I don't care if he is the father-in-law from Hell.

And this "true love" nonsense with Talia. So she is technically the mother of Bruce's son. Damian was born from a test tube - not from true love. And from what I can tell any romantic notions between Bruce and Talia that existed in the old DCU and dead and buried in the New 52. They appear to be bitter exes now.

So I wouldn't even put that relationship in the same room as Peter and Mary Jane, Reed and Sue, Ben and Alicia, Kal-El and Lois, Hal and Carol, etc.

[Dr Kain]

Quote:

Originally Posted by trebleshot

I can tell any romantic notions between Bruce and Talia that existed in the old DCU and dead and buried in the New 52. They appear to be bitter exes now.

Sorry, but I don't care what the N52 does, my definitive Batman stories are those from Neal Adams, Dick Giordano, Denny O'Neil, and Len Wein in the 70s. Out of all of the Batman stuff I have read over the last 20ish years (started reading Batman comics in the early 90s), the stuff those guys did in the 70s has been by far the best of the best. The most interesting stories, the best artwork, etc. I just wish they would collect everything from the 70s chronologically.

BTW, I still consider Peter and Gwen to be the definitive Spider-Man couple, NOT MJ.

[CMIII]

I agree with you fully about Mattel being cheap they give cheap answers to questions And if you do look at this year the first 6 figures of 2013 only 2 have been what we asked for (Phantom Stranger and Wally West Flash), I feel Guardians should have been with Saint Walker (Ganthet and Sayd) Larfleeze should had Glommulus, Elastic-Man easily could have included accessories, and Red Hood looks like a Dr. Mario Reject, and Mallah was a lousey redo.

My opinion of Phantom Stranger I could have lived without it, not that he is unimportant (he's about to be a headliner in a major DC event called the Trinity War) but The Character means nothing to me personally, Next month I get the figure I really want and the one that drew me to get the Subscription Captain Marvel Jr.

As for Ra's being the most important villain in Batman's Rouges gallery I have to disagree. Chris Nolan made him Important if I name Batman's villain Ra's doesn't appear until after 10 closer to 15 and Talia doesn't even get mentioned (Joker, Penguin, Scarecrow, Bane, Catwoman, Mr. Freeze, Riddler, Killer Croc, Poison Ivy, Solomon Grundy, Lex Luthor, Catman, Two Face, Ventriloquist I and Dummy, Ra's Al Ghul, Ventriloquist II and Dummy, Calender Man, Clayface, Black Mask, Red Hood, Victor Zazas, Owlman, and Talon

[trebleshot]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr Kain

Sorry, but I don't care what the N52 does, my definitive Batman stories are those from Neal Adams, Dick Giordano, Denny O'Neil, and Len Wein in the 70s. Out of all of the Batman stuff I have read over the last 20ish years (started reading Batman comics in the early 90s), the stuff those guys did in the 70s has been by far the best of the best. The most interesting stories, the best artwork, etc. I just wish they would collect everything from the 70s chronologically.

And if that works for you, great. As for me, I don't rate the importance of a character based only on specific bodies of work. That's like me saying Mr. Freeze is the greatest Batman villain ever because I only count his two starring episodes of TAS. Again, that's just my opinion and how I think about things like this.

I also don't state my opinions as facts. Whether that was your intention or not, I don't know. But that's the way it reads, since there's no indication otherwise.

EDIT: And just to be clear, it's perfectly fine for you to have that opinion about Ra's. I've got no problem with that. I just think you might want to choose your words a little more carefully in the future. That's all I'm really saying.

Quote:

BTW, I still consider Peter and Gwen to be the definitive Spider-Man couple, NOT MJ.

I would too, if it weren't for the fact that she's dead and MJ is not (in the comics, currently).

Quote:

Originally Posted by CMIII

As for Ra's being the most important villain in Batman's Rouges gallery I have to disagree. Chris Nolan made him Important if I name Batman's villain Ra's doesn't appear until after 10 closer to 15 and Talia doesn't even get mentioned (Joker, Penguin, Scarecrow, Bane, Catwoman, Mr. Freeze, Riddler, Killer Croc, Poison Ivy, Solomon Grundy, Lex Luthor, Catman, Two Face, Ventriloquist I and Dummy, Ra's Al Ghul, Ventriloquist II and Dummy, Calender Man, Clayface, Black Mask, Red Hood, Victor Zazas, Owlman, and Talon

I honestly wouldn't put Lex that high up on a Batman Rogues list, but that whole list is a topic for another thread.

[CMIII]

Quote:

Originally Posted by trebleshot

I honestly wouldn't put Lex that high up on a Batman Rogues list, but that whole list is a topic for another thread.

Lex was why Bruce Wayne ended up in Blackgate

[CMIII]

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1987olds442

Pull the trigger please.

Honestly Dr. Kain I do expect to see Ra's eventually (as obscure as Matty) Talia I would say thats a no you'll get her the same day we get a Suited Lex Luthor, Lois Lane, Vicky Vale, Dr. Magnus, and so many other non hero/villain characters

[Iceman]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr Kain

Sorry, but I don't care what the N52 does, my definitive Batman stories are those from Neal Adams, Dick Giordano, Denny O'Neil, and Len Wein in the 70s. Out of all of the Batman stuff I have read over the last 20ish years (started reading Batman comics in the early 90s), the stuff those guys did in the 70s has been by far the best of the best. The most interesting stories, the best artwork, etc. I just wish they would collect everything from the 70s chronologically.

BTW, I still consider Peter and Gwen to be the definitive Spider-Man couple, NOT MJ.

I'm sure there is a comic book hipster joke to be made here lol. I know that Stan Lee had always intended for Gwen to be the one and only girl for Peter but that didn't happen. As with most of this stuff a lot of it has to do with nostalgia and personal preference. My first experiences with Spider-Man were the 90's cartoon so he and MJ make sense to me and were together for a long time. Nothing against Gwen. Heck, Peter should just move to Utah and take Gwen, MJ, and Felica with him. A brave new hero for a brave new world lol.

[Dr Kain]

Quote:

Originally Posted by CMIII

and Mallah was a lousey redo.

I actually found Mallah to be great as he is exactly what I expected.

Quote:

My opinion of Phantom Stranger I could have lived without it, not that he is unimportant (he's about to be a headliner in a major DC event called the Trinity War) but The Character means nothing to me personally, Next month I get the figure I really want and the one that drew me to get the Subscription Captain Marvel Jr.

That is how I am about Marvel Jr. The only thing I have read with him are the Crisis on Multiple Earths books when the JL went to the Marvel world and CoIE. Outside of that, I know next to nothing about him.

Quote:

As for Ra's being the most important villain in Batman's Rouges gallery I have to disagree. Chris Nolan made him Important

Actually, I'd say BTAS made him important.

BTW, I have no idea who Talon is.

Quote:

Originally Posted by trebleshot

I also don't state my opinions as facts. Whether that was your intention or not, I don't know. But that's the way it reads, since there's no indication otherwise.

When did I say anything was a fact? What I post is my opinion and nothing but my opinion. It is only obvious if you read the reply was DR KAIN. Just like anything you post is YOUR opinion and anything CMIII posts is HIS opinion. I'm not going to put IMO every time I say something as that is redundant and I'm pretty sure you're smart and can understand the concept of what is opinion and fact.

I do agree about Lex. Why would you put him on a Batman rogue's list?

[CMIII]

We all have a list of Characters that have been done and could say Why? or Do we really need 9 of him/her. As much as I am not 100% with you on everything Kain your right the great thing about America and the Internet is everyone can express their opinion no matter how stupid, different, or pointless (Note I am not saying anyones opinion is that i am using it for Emphasis). Heck I'm sure Kain and I agree on Fire or why there needed to be 9 versions of Hal Jordan in the DCUC.

Lex was more of Bruce Waynes enemy then Batman's. Her Death in Wayne Manor led to a period in which Bruce Wayne was arrested and tossed into Blackgate, the result was that Bruce could not use his Alibi (Batman) to save himself. The Killer was David Cain but it was ordered by President Lex Luthor, eventually Bruce Escapes and is cleared and Lex is going to be linked to the Murder so he orders Deadshot to kill Cain, Cain repents for his past and shoots Deadshot.

So yes Lex Luthor is a Batman villain

Captain Marvel Jr. is much older then most of the Other Comic book heroes and villains his time was from 1941 - 1950 then again 1970 - 2004, then he became Shazam! replacing Billy Batson following 52 he also was a member of the Teen Titans and associate member of Young Justice. As a character he has had a definite impact on the world in particular the Music Industry. Elvis Presley had/has a huge collection of Captain Marvel Jr comics (Originals) and based his Jumpsuites off of Captain Marvel Jr.

I do ask Dr. Cain to remember the you can please some of the people some of the time but not all the people all the time. If they did a Full year where nothing but Ra's, Talia, Mad Hatter, and etc I doubt I would renew sighting disconnect from DC Universe and before you say "You didn't sign up for this crap." If Mattel put out a year of nothing but Ambush Bug then you signed up for that they decide whats released. Really they should do a popularity pole pick 26 - 30 characters and let people vote for the 13 they will release any not selected will move to the next year and start again

[Dr Kain]

Actually, the only Batman villain I want most of all is Ras. Ras is the thing that would get me to resub again next year because right now, I am not planning to sub again. I'll just become a cherry picker and buy the figures from my local comic shop as they get them in and I am friends with the owner (knew him long before he opened the store) so he will sell them to me for a couple dollars over what he paid. Of course, that is if I am still collecting the line at all next year. Mattel has really sucked the fun out of collecting for me. I've already dumped MOTUC and have been slowly selling off my collection, and while I will not sell every piece of DCU, I could use the money saved from buying the new stuff for Figuarts, especially since it looks like I won't be having a full time job until at least Aug 2014.

[CMIII]

I cherry picked the Club Year 1 and regret it because I missed September - November. Really Mattel needs to listen more and decide less. I could open the DC Encyclopedia pick 30 characters and let fans decide each month. I have to admit Kain I hope they do him before 2014, and not to shut you up about it but because you deserve Ra's I'm gonna try a poll that Mattel should do see if I could give people what they want

[1987olds442]

[trebleshot]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr Kain

When did I say anything was a fact? What I post is my opinion and nothing but my opinion. It is only obvious if you read the reply was DR KAIN. Just like anything you post is YOUR opinion and anything CMIII posts is HIS opinion. I'm not going to put IMO every time I say something as that is redundant and I'm pretty sure you're smart and can understand the concept of what is opinion and fact.

"Stating an opinion as fact" doesn't always mean you literally say something and claim it is a fact. It also refers to making blanket statements like "Ra's is the most important Batman villain" without following it up with an explanation for why you feel that is true. By saying it that way, you make it sound as if it is a universal truth, which it is not. At least to some people.

And not everything we post is opinion, either. So assuming that it is opinion is also a logical fallacy.

I also don't expect anyone to add IMO or IMHO to everything they post - it would become quite tedious. But a generous portion of the "I" pronoun would help. "I think", "I feel", "I believe", etc. would go just as far as those oft-used initialisms to indicate you intend the statement to be taken as your opinion.

While I do consider myself smart enough to discern fact from opinion, I have absolutely no idea how the poster intended it to be read. I can only go by my understanding of the words and their context.

Also, forgive the grammar cop tangent. Just a quirk of mine, which I will gladly drop for the sake of the thread. PM me if you wish to discuss it further.

Quote:

I do agree about Lex. Why would you put him on a Batman rogue's list?

Because you can technically consider him a Batman villain (and a villain to the DCU as a whole, especially after that whole Presidency thing). Same thing applies to the Joker. The Harlequin has threatened more than just Gotham on occasion and has had run-ins with other super heroes, such as Superman. So technically you could have the Joker on a list of Superman villains.

Even Ra's al Ghul can be added to other rogues galleries, if we want to split hairs.

And after all this back-and-forth about Ra's, I still wouldn't mind getting a DCUC-style toy of him. I have absolutely no interest in the Movie Masters version from TDKR (not that I didn't like Neeson in the role, just don't like the figure).

[CMIII]

It's really hard to X is more important then anyone else because who ever that may be, may not matter to anyone else. Look at it this way some of the most important characters were not in DCUC (Catwoman, Merlyn, Ra's, or Poison Ivy) we ended up getting characters even die hard fans don't know or have even heard of (Golden Pharaoh, Cyclatron, or Tyr). Heck Mattel didn't varient characters that they really should have (Hawk, Dove, and Question) *IMO* who wouldn't have wanted Holly Granger, Don Hall, and Renee Montoya

[Dr Kain]

Holly Granger? Is she some Harry Potter fan?

[ToyAddict]

Quote:

Originally Posted by CMIII

Heck Mattel didn't varient characters that they really should have (Hawk, Dove, and Question) *IMO* who wouldn't have wanted Holly Granger, Don Hall, and Renee Montoya

I wouldn't. Don Hall yes. Others no. Just sayin'.

[squeezeplay]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ToyAddict

I wouldn't. Don Hall yes. Others no. Just sayin'.

I would love to get a Don Hall on the Wave 3 Sinestro body or even the 2-pack style Sinestro upper body w/wave 3 Sinestro lower body.

I would want the 2 females listed only under these circumstances:

The retail line continued and the sub ran congruent to that. Those 2 female characters were in the sub and characters like Kate Kane Batwoman and Steph Brown BG were in the retail line.

Under those circumstances I would probably buy those 2 sub figures day of but only that way.

Barring that, there are so many other figures I would rather see made first...

[1987olds442]

[Iceman]

What's that yellow sword from?

[squeezeplay]

That's the Xevoz Hyper Guardian figure. Super-htf and I've been trying to get that sword for ages now.

[CMIII]

Holly Granger replaced Hank Hall same as Dawn Granger replaced Don Hall. I just think it would have been cool to have the three Main incarnations of Hawk and Dove and only need 2 more figures
Holly Granger is not Hermione Granger although both are British