[Dolemite]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thor Laserpunch

I actually do also prefer the panel lines and silver paint over colored plastic, although finding a Select with good enough paint was….difficult to be sure. Not saying ML sucks or anything, but after this long of a wait for an iconic look for such a central villain and all the bullshit wtf nobody asked for these interpretations figures we got over the past 20 years, I don’t see it as quite a homerun.

I didn’t read the whole convo because I already knew what side I’m on, but wasn’t the whole Ultron size thing properly litigated earlier? I like him taller. In that sense, I don’t care too much if that’s specific to certain artists or whatever.

Classic Ultron was ALWAYS human-sized. ALWAYS. He was never taller than humans.




Also, the ML Ultron IS colored plastic, yes, but it's the best colored plastic Hasbro has ever done. It's not that wonky marbleized plastic, it honestly looks painted, but somehow it's not. Or is it? I don't know. All I DO know is that this is literally a perfect classic Ultron and it pisses all over the MS version. There's no debate about this.

Again, I'll do a side-by-side when I can dig out the Ultron area on my Legends shelf...the Ultron area is in the back, so it'll be a pain in the balls to get to them, but once I do I'll take the pics.

[Thor Laserpunch]

Lmao I know exactly what you mean about the plastic. E.g., like the Walgreens Silver Surfer vs. the previous crappy “comic” Ultron.

I did specify “personal preference” in regards to size because there is no universe where some 5’10” muhfuh is gonna bully me around when I could just shove him back on his ass. I give zero fucks if you’re a robot fool, sit ya ass down bitch. That’s how it plays out in my mind anyways, not really sure what would happen immediately afterwards but probably worth it.

[TheBlueMarvel]

@Laserpunch

Yeah it was discussed about a week back...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dolemite

Classic Ultron was ALWAYS human-sized. ALWAYS. He was never taller than humans.




Also, the ML Ultron IS colored plastic, yes, but it's the best colored plastic Hasbro has ever done. It's not that wonky marbleized plastic, it honestly looks painted, but somehow it's not. Or is it? I don't know. All I DO know is that this is literally a perfect classic Ultron and it pisses all over the MS version. There's no debate about this.

Again, I'll do a side-by-side when I can dig out the Ultron area on my Legends shelf...the Ultron area is in the back, so it'll be a pain in the balls to get to them, but once I do I'll take the pics.

Without regurgitating everything, there have been some discrepancies between listed height and depictions of Ultron over the years. You're welcome to go back and look and read, but I suspect you may have already done so as this feels a little forced. Everybody has a preference, a mind's eye for both heroes and villains. And those preferences can be based on specific artists or an amalgam of images over time. Personally, I wouldn't use either Milgrom or Zeck (the pencilers responsible for creating the images you used) as a pictorial foundation for 'classic' looks for ANY character. The aesthetics, scale, and proportions of both artists were memorable in bad ways and I suspect most of the reason they got as much work as they did (I suffered through Milgrom's run on Spectacular only out of love for Spidey) was because they could reliably meet deadlines and likely came cheaper than other more popular talents. But specifically about some of what you've written, Thor is human-sized. Shaq is also human sized. Some humans are considerably taller than other humans. While Ultron's no human, for sure, he's often been illustrated with a form larger than that of the average male. In both stature and physical size, Ultron is closer in form to that of Thor than he is of Iron Man.

The new Ultron fig is better than what Hasbro has produced previously, but it's still diminutive (looks like kid next to the new Thor fig) and could have benefitted from greater height and girth. It's great that you like it and the sculpt is satisfying, but it still leaves me wanting and apparently others as well. That's without mentioning that poorly implemented ball-peg torso that limits the figs ability to pitch forward to stoop and lumber over fallen foes as Ultron often does. And the lack of a waist swivel creates some pretty ugly side profiles when you pose the fig dynamically. When the dust settles, I think there will still be calls for an updated Ultron...

[hasbroherofan]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dolemite

This figure is literally perfect. I wouldn't change a thing. I like what the guy above did with the Ultron head from the retro Vision figure, but I honestly consider it a downgrade. This is the perfect Ultron as-is, head and all.

Also, I never really cared either way about the new pinless joints, but they so totally work here. The seamless look really drives home that he's a robot. Great work, Hasbro.

Can’t wait for my order to get here.

[Nimrod]

[QUOTE=TheBlueMarvel;


While Ultron's no human, for sure, he's often been illustrated with a form larger than that of the average male. In both stature and physical size, Ultron is closer in form to that of Thor than he is of Iron Man.

The new Ultron fig is better than what Hasbro has produced previously, but it's still diminutive (looks like kid next to the new Thor fig) and could have benefitted from greater height and girth. It's great that you like it and the sculpt is satisfying, but it still leaves me wanting and apparently others as well. That's without mentioning that poorly implemented ball-peg torso that limits the figs ability to pitch forward to stoop and lumber over fallen foes as Ultron often does. And the lack of a waist swivel creates some pretty ugly side profiles when you pose the fig dynamically. When the dust settles, I think there will still be calls for an updated Ultron...[/QUOTE]


"Lack of a waist swivel"?? Ultron has a waist swivel, it's right under the belt. And again, we're gonna have to agree to disagree about this "diminutive" scale you say he has. He's slightly taller than both Ironman/Cap figures & Cap is listed as being 6'2 & in armored form, Ironman is also about 6'2, so the fact that Ultron is a bit taller than both of em would make him in the 6'3-6'4 range. Thor is 6'6. I have yet to find any pics of the MK8 Ultron, which this figure is based on , where Ultron towers over any Avenger, you posted a pic where you say he's the same hgt as Thor & again, I think he's standing on rubble in the pic. As far as an "updated" Ultron, if by that you mean taller, then you might as well stick with the MS version as that is what it seems you are asking for. The only "updated" Ultron I would want is this 99' version from the Perez/Busiek run, & again, in the same scale as the current MK8 version.

[Dolemite]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thor Laserpunch

Lmao I know exactly what you mean about the plastic. E.g., like the Walgreens Silver Surfer vs. the previous crappy “comic” Ultron.

I did specify “personal preference” in regards to size because there is no universe where some 5’10” muhfuh is gonna bully me around when I could just shove him back on his ass. I give zero fucks if you’re a robot fool, sit ya ass down bitch. That’s how it plays out in my mind anyways, not really sure what would happen immediately afterwards but probably worth it.

lol. Apparently you is one baaaaaaad motherfucker. But yeah, I get what you're saying. Hopefully whenever I get around the posting a side by side picture that'll help you make up your mind which version you like better. Just because I'm jizzing to the ML version doesn't mean everybody will.

[TheBlueMarvel]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nimrod

"Lack of a waist swivel"?? Ultron has a waist swivel, it's right under the belt. And again, we're gonna have to agree to disagree about this "diminutive" scale you say he has. He's slightly taller than both Ironman/Cap figures & Cap is listed as being 6'2 & in armored form, Ironman is also about 6'2, so the fact that Ultron is a bit taller than both of em would make him in the 6'3-6'4 range. Thor is 6'6. I have yet to find any pics of the MK8 Ultron, which this figure is based on , where Ultron towers over any Avenger, you posted a pic where you say he's the same hgt as Thor & again, I think he's standing on rubble in the pic. As far as an "updated" Ultron, if by that you mean taller, then you might as well stick with the MS version as that is what it seems you are asking for. The only "updated" Ultron I would want is this 99' version from the Perez/Busiek run, & again, in the same scale as the current MK8 version.

Yes, and now we've come full circle, as I replied to you last week that we'll need to agree to disagree. Now that you've reiterated it, it's well and truly official...

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheBlueMarvel

We'll have to agree to disagree then as it regards my mind's eye perception of how tall and imposing Ultron should be. Especially if you are dismissing artistic interpretation in favor of official height listings. FYI - because, of course, I checked before responding the first time - the OHotMU does indeed list Ultron at 6', however, it also lists Tony in Iron Man II armor at 6'4", which I flatly rejected on its face. This sort of size discrepancy, one never depicted in the books, is exactly IMO why artistic interpretation, especially that of iconic artists, is the literal rubric to which I usually default. After all, the artwork not only sets the stage, it is the principal modality through which we are introduced to all things comic book (no disrespect to writers, they are undoubtedly the storytellers, but this is a visual medium).

Lets take a closer look at how two iconic artists (that I know you like and have mentioned often) depict Ultron: John Byrne and George Perez. I'll start with commissioned pieces similar to the first photo you used. The fact that these are 'commissioned' pieces is important because that means someone is paying for work not only highly representational of the heroes and eras therein, but emblematic of the ultimate expressions of said artist on said subject matter.



As you might be able to see, in Byrne's eyes, Ultron is meant to be pretty corded/yoked and every bit as large as Thor. Notice the quads. The Shoulders. The thickness of the biceps. You can even see dude's lats from the damn front...he's deez'ed ('diesel' for those that didn't grow up in NYC circa 86'-95').

On a side note: Didn't you customize a Vision fig because you thought the mold to be too little? Looks like Byrne doesn't view ol' boy with the same lenses.

'

Here's a black and white Perez commission of Ultron. The black and white presentation might actually make it easier to see differences in size/girth. Again, Ultron is easily the size of Thor and Tony is somewhat dwarfed even while wearing a bulkier more modern armor. Now something can always be said of intended perspectives within any illustration and Tony is slightly recessed into the background, but it's a no brainer that this Iron Man armor is not of a similar stature to that of Thor.

Let's juxtapose the previous illustrations and my takeaways from the Perez commission to the following comic panels taking another look at that iconic battle with the Avengers that I posted yesterday. Pay specific attention to the legs, thickness of the arms, and Ultron's comparative form to those of both Thor and Wonder Man (bigger dudes than Iron Man):







While they both have metal armors, Ulron and Iron Man have not and should not share the same proportions IMHO. All said though, your second photo made me feel a little better in that Ultron doesn't look to be 'shorter' than goober azz Tony. However, based on the Iron Man fig's feet being set oh so slightly farther apart, I'd guess Ultron's as tall as Iron Man, which is:

Here's your response from last week that seems to come quite close to agreeing...even going as far as to cite that you have the illustrations I used in special Ultron files you keep on your computer. Still not saying anything about that; we all got our kink we keep tucked away from prying eyes.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nimrod

Awesome retort my friend. I have those very pics that you posted in my favorite Ultron pics file. I totally agree that Tony in armor is not 6'4, heck some books have him listed as being 6'6 in armor...Bolderdash I say! Byrne does tend to draw the Vision with a slim build but at 6'3, 300lbs, he should be buffer imo so I differ to the Perez, Buscema, Heck versions of him. Based on the pics of Ultron next to MOD IM, he represents the 6 ft-6'2 scale & I'm good to go with that. I always love to use these panels to demonstrate that Tony does not grow in hgt when armoring up due to the armor being skin tight. No way he gains 4-6 inches in hgt, at most 2 inches as the boot soles would be at least an inch thick & another inch of helmet padding as the helmet wouldn't be rubbing up against his scalp, imagine the rug burn from that! So 6'2 armored up in any & all armors minus the mission specific armors. My custom Vision.

Also the OHBotMU back in the day didn't list Ultron at 6'2". It actually listed him as 6' and Iron Man II at 6'4", which is ground we also covered discussing what seemed to be a shared understanding that Ultron has never been depicted as shorter than Tony in any illustrations.

It never ceases to amaze me the deep seated umbrage people take to someone not liking something that they like, especially on the internet. I know humans lean toward the gregarious side of the ledger and flock both mentally and physically, but, while I'm not a contrarian, I'm also not necessarily one to fall in with general consensus.

If you like this figure, like it to bits. What do I care? It's become fashionable to hate on Pizza Spidey, but none of that has changed my fondness for the fig and I still prefer it over the retro version we were recently delivered. Thanks for letting me know the Ultron fig has a waist swivel as my order is still winding its way to my home.

Also, I find a good bit of humor in the fact that you, someone that digs this fig, have already announced that you will be joining me in calls for a redone Ultron. Thank you, I appreciate your support in this endeavor.

[Dolemite]

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheBlueMarvel

Personally, I wouldn't use either Milgrom or Zeck (the pencilers responsible for creating the images you used) as a pictorial foundation for 'classic' looks for ANY character.

I just used those specific pics 'cause I did a Google search for "classic Ultron" and those popped up. But I personally dug the art in the original Secret Wars a lot, so whatever.

Quote:

I suspect most of the reason they got as much work as they did (I suffered through Milgrom's run on Spectacular only out of love for Spidey) was because they could reliably meet deadlines and likely came cheaper than other more popular talents.

That's why Travis Charest could never hang as a monthly guy. Some people know how to cut corners to meet deadlines, and some people's art suffers more for it than others. That's the funnybook game, y'all.

Quote:

But specifically about some of what you've written, Thor is human-sized. Shaq is also human sized. Some humans are considerably taller than other humans.

WOW REALLY YOU DON'T SAY

Quote:

While Ultron's no human, for sure, he's often been illustrated with a form larger than that of the average male.

Yet you JUST said this:

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheBlueMarvel

Also the OHBotMU back in the day didn't list Ultron at 6'2". It actually listed him as 6'

That hardly puts him as the same size as Thor, which you also claim is the case.

And yes, I know you said that the reality of comic book art puts Ultron at slightly different sizes when compared to different characters, but that's happened with EVERY COMIC BOOK CHARACTER EVER. Heights remain approximate but never completely consistent. The perils of having different artists and all!

Wolverine is never consistently drawn as if he's exactly 5'3" compared to other characters. He's just drawn varying degrees of short.

Man, you should watch Fist of the North Star. Your mind would be blown. Characters change size multiple times in the same scene, lol.

Quote:

The new Ultron fig is better than what Hasbro has produced previously, but it's still diminutive

Scale seems consistent with how these two have been depicted in the comics.

Quote:

and could have benefitted from greater height and girth.

A wee, tiny bit of extra size wouldn't matter to me, but it also wouldn't have hurt the figure in anyway ether, so I'll give you that much.

But personally, I am 100 percent satisfied with the figure we got and have zero desire for it to be redone in any way.

Quote:

It's great that you like it and the sculpt is satisfying

It is!

Quote:

And the lack of a waist swivel

oh hai

Quote:

When the dust settles, I think there will still be calls for an updated Ultron...

I seriously doubt it.

[Dolemite]

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheBlueMarvel

It never ceases to amaze me the deep seated umbrage people take to someone not liking something that they like, especially on the internet. I know humans lean toward the gregarious side of the ledger and flock both mentally and physically, but, while I'm not a contrarian, I'm also not necessarily one to fall in with general consensus.

You probably don't have them, but going forward I'm going to picture you with a fedora and neckbeard.

BTW, I personally don't care if you hate the new Ultron or clutch it tightly every night while rubbing one out.

Quote:

If you like this figure, like it to bits. What do I care?

Clearly you care. You're practically writing dissertations on how it's not lining up with your personal expectations.

Quote:

It's become fashionable to hate on Pizza Spidey, but none of that has changed my fondness for the fig and I still prefer it over the retro version we were recently delivered.

Okay, I HAVE to side with you here. Pizza Spidey is awesome, and yes, better than the recent retro version.

Quote:

Also, I find a good bit of humor in the fact that you, someone that digs this fig, have already announced that you will be joining me in calls for a redone Ultron. Thank you, I appreciate your support in this endeavor.

Uh...he didn't? Either I missed something, or you're totally making shit up now.

[TheBlueMarvel]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dolemite

I just used those specific pics 'cause I did a Google search for "classic Ultron" and those popped up. But I personally dug the art in the original Secret Wars a lot, so whatever.out.

Zeck has done some things well, but his Secret War stuff was pretty phoned in.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dolemite

WOW REALLY YOU DON'T SAY

Yet you JUST said this:
That hardly puts him as the same size as Thor, which you also claim is the case. Please be consistent at least.

Yeah, I employed that language to demonstrate that "giants" come in human-sizes as well making your suggestion that Ultron is 'always human-sized' less than meaningful given that it's a spectrum that includes exactly what I was suggesting.

Also, there's no inconsistency in what I wrote because what I was drawing upon is the fact that Ultron has never been illustrated as smaller than Iron Man, despite being listed as such in OHotMU. The extrapolation being that you kinda have to toss out official listings and use iconic imagery and artists (such as Byrne and Perez).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dolemite

In this pic you posted, there's barely any size difference at all between ANY of the Avengers and Ultron, even when taking perspective into account. The way this is drawn it looks like everyone is two feet away from Ultron.

I used to draw a lot of comicbook art as a hobby as a kid which may account for my seeing things differently than you. I look at limbs - comparative length and width - trunks/torsos along the same lines and I count the number of heads-high for height in proportion to the skull. That's generally how they train artists to draw the human form - IIRC it's the eight heads rule? But, whatever, you grease your skids however you choose, everyone has a different perspective.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dolemite

Scale seems consistent with how these two have been depicted in the comics.

I wouldn't use a top down angle for a height comparison, but, yes, they are close. But that's also not the point I'm making.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dolemite

Maybe a wee bit, I'll give you that.

Yuuuuup, that's only ever been the point I've been making from the very start, yet here we are...

Hmmmm, I'm not asking you to give me anything because your opinion is immaterial to mine. See my earlier 'consensus' remark.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dolemite

It is!

oh hai

Haha! Snark on, my dude! Yes, my order has not arrived yet. Still looks pretty ugly though; they should have gone with an ab crunch and could have if they weren't shooting for a sleek toned stomach. Ultron doesn't exactly strike me as body insecure and a light-beer drinker.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dolemite

I seriously doubt it.

Well, ok. I said the same thing about the Abomination years ago regarding the delivery of a proper Hulk. Time will tell...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dolemite

BTW, I have no desire to get into the anal-retentive debates that seem to be your shtick. Just posting my opinion. I personally don't care if you hate the new Ultron or clutch it tightly every night while rubbing one out.

This was the best part because it smacked as the most disingenuous. I find it curious when people employ the micro, line by line response technique - a style that I've seen you deploy in other situations. It demonstrates a certain tedium, fastidiousness, and pettiness that doesn't quite line up with, "this is all beneath me." I'm not debating anyone when I respond here. This is how I express my thoughts online, or in person - in their fullness. I can't help when someone assumes a defensive posture, that's more about them than it is about me.

As far as my schtick is concerned (you getting fresh with me, Rudy Ray??? )...lol...uhhhh...you don't exactly have a record here free of acrimonious conversations. And couldn't everything you've posted here over the last few hours fall into the category of at least courting the very debates for which you claim to have no desire?

It's all good man, as long as you picked up some extras of that bum azz Spymaster you were so happy to get and did your job to clear that shit off the pegs! You can tuck this Ultron under your pillow along with Spysie!

Jokes...I'm just fucking wit' you...'til next time!

Edit: oh shit, next time came sooner than I thought...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dolemite

Uh...he didn't? Either I missed something, or you're totally making shit up now.

Lol I'm not making anything up as much as you might not be paying attention. He said the only update he would want was the '99 version, which I also want and would have preferred to this one. Not to mention the tongue and cheek nature of those last two sentences - but I guess I should come to expect certain things here, you know what they say about arguments with 'tards' - jokes again...

Seriously tho', you don't exactly sound like someone not looking for friction. But anyway...s'all gud, still.

[Dr Kain]

I don't post for like a day and I come back and find a huge argument over Ultron's... figure height?

[TheBlueMarvel]

Not an argument...just opinionated people opinion'izing.

I laughed at the fedora and neck beard...no, neither the accoutrement nor the beard choice tracks in my particular subset of the black community.

[Benn Roe]

That Ultron is fully painted, by the way. The Legends team mentioned it a month or two back on one of their livestreams.

[Nimrod]

Let's put this "Ultron looks like a kid next to Thor" debate to an end, shall we. Ultron comes up to Thor's eye/forehead level, so I fail to see where he looks like a "kid" next to Thor. And he is a robot, his design is sleek, yet elegant with a gleam in his eye! Pics don't lie, Ultron looks perfect next to Thor!

[TheBlueMarvel]

A prefect teen? That 7th pic where he gets up on his tippy toes to punch Thor in the face really drove it home for me.

[Dolemite]

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheBlueMarvel

I laughed at the fedora and neck beard...no, neither the accoutrement nor the beard choice tracks in my particular subset of the black community.

That's funny. With my screen name I can't tell you how many people mistake me as a black guy when I'm just a big Rudy Ray fan. And by your manner of internet speech, I would have totally pegged you as a...well, neckbearded, fedora wearin' white guy, lol. No offence.

But whatever. I have no beef with you. In the end, we all love toys, and we all have specific wants and expectations when it comes to them. None are more valid than others. Well, except mine.

But overall, this is probably the silliest debate I've ever had here. Let's agree to disagree and move on.

[Dolemite]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Benn Roe

That Ultron is fully painted, by the way. The Legends team mentioned it a month or two back on one of their livestreams.

Yeah, I just noticed that when I turned Ulty's waist swivel and saw the unpainted area. But thanks for pointing that out.

[TheBlueMarvel]

lol I actually think you are cool peeps...You've made me laugh many times over the years.

Don't ever sweat anything I say...I'm usually bored or drunk.

[Dolemite]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr Kain

I don't post for like a day and I come back and find a huge argument over Ultron's... figure height?

It's probably why I post in this threat so infrequently. Drama always ensues.

[Dolemite]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nimrod

Let's put this "Ultron looks like a kid next to Thor" debate to an end, shall we. Ultron comes up to Thor's eye/forehead level, so I fail to see where he looks like a "kid" next to Thor. And he is a robot, his design is sleek, yet elegant with a gleam in his eye! Pics don't lie, Ultron looks perfect next to Thor!

Again, it's consistent with how that version of Ulty has been depicted in the comics. Making him a tiny bit bigger really wouldn't make much of a difference, but I can see how that would make a certain segment of society happier.

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheBlueMarvel

A prefect teen? That 7th pic where he gets up on his tippy toes to punch Thor in the face really drove it home for me.

Ulty's lead foot is planted flat in that shot.

[Harbinger]

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheBlueMarvel

lol I actually think you are cool peeps...You've made me laugh many times over the years.

Don't ever sweat anything I say...I'm usually bored or drunk.

Or bored drunk.

[hasbroherofan]

Tease for this coming week.
https://twitter.com/DanYunIsTrying/s...662901248?s=20

Shot by Tarantino.

[Nimrod]

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheBlueMarvel

A prefect teen? That 7th pic where he gets up on his tippy toes to punch Thor in the face really drove it home for me.

I put that foot up in that pose to show off the great detailof the boot jet thrusters that Hasbro put into his boot heel, something I don't think they've done for Ironman. You just commented on the 7th pic, what about the face to face scale comp pics? Does Ultron still look "kiddish" next to Thor? You know full well he doesn't.

[TheBlueMarvel]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nimrod

I put that foot up in that pose to show off the great detailof the boot jet thrusters that Hasbro put into his boot heel, something I don't think they've done for Ironman. You just commented on the 7th pic, what about the face to face scale comp pics? Does Ultron still look "kiddish" next to Thor? You know full well he doesn't.

Yeah, he looks like a teen. Teens are kids, unless of course you're Matt Gaetz, then they're paid-for dates. If you wanna show off that boot detail, have him climb up on a little 1/12 footstool to bust the Odinson one in the chops!

[TheBlueMarvel]

Quote:

Originally Posted by hasbroherofan

Tease for this coming week.
https://twitter.com/DanYunIsTrying/s...662901248?s=20

Shot by Tarantino.

It's the Wizard.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Harbinger

Or bored drunk.

Don't you know it!