When I was a kid in the 90's the X-Men cartoon was the biggest thing for Marvel. X-Men and Spider-Man were what succeeded. We didn't know who the Avengers where. The Hulk and Iron Man TV shows weren't has good and didn't do as well (sold a lot less toys too). Cap was barely a c-list guy along with Iron Man. Before Marvel pushed them into onto the nation scene Marvel's biggest names were Spider-Man, The X-Men, The Hulk, and then guys like the Fantastic Four or Daredevil. Iron Man, Cap, and Thor were not very well known to most people.

I'm not saying they were bad characters or that in the realm of comic book readers they weren't big names but they were largely unknown to most. Before I read Ultimates and got into comics I thought of Thor as in Norse mythology and Cap I only knew his origin from appearing on Spider-Man and the Avengers arcade game (had no idea what that was about as a kid).

It's crazy when you get older and see how much of a difference there can be between people born 5 years after you, much less 10 or 20. They just don't know a lot of the things that we did. I find it weird because I was the kid that would watch old movies and try to appreciate old stuff so I figured that more kids would do that today since it's all so easy to access with the internet or Netflix or whatever. Then I realized that kids have too much new content coming at them from every direction (Youtube, social media, etc). A lot of us had a handful of channels and were forced to watch reruns of old shows and movies so we learned that there was cool stuff there. Maybe some day the X-Men will get a reset and proper movies made about the comic or just another solid TV show that kids attach to.

This is an extremely valid point. It's about exposure. (90s Ironman, Hulk, and Fan4 were good, but not until season 2 for each. At that point, they were already shuffled off to 4-5 am time slots and the toy lines were already DOA. That one has more to do with the first initial seasons being such child pandering spoon feeding "they are laughing in your face" crap. Sadly the damage was already done even with as amazing as those season 2s were. That's a different type of media issue though.)

In the 90s because of that toon, the main figure I always wanted for my toybiz X-Men collection was Jubilee, a female figure. She was the initial audience entry way into the show and character universe. She did finally get a figure in the Generation X line, but it was a crap staction figure with an action gimmick. Later her robot fighters figure wasn't much better. They never covered that iconic costume she wore in the 90s X-Men animated series. Demand for that figure was tangible across the board, and because of the archaic view that "action figures are boys toys and they don't buy female figures" she was never made in the same way the others were and that would have sold better than even the 200+ wolverines that were made by toy biz at the time.

Character exposure is everything for kids. If not for the animated appearances and movie appearances that also brings them to the comics, none of the characters would move anywhere near as much as they do. Visibility is a key factor. This exposure tends to dictate taste for decades. Because of the various animated series over the decades and the various movie forays(from the 60s to now, not just the 90s to now) everyone is partial to certain areas. For some it's Pryde of the X-Men, others it's the Gambit Rogue relationship of the 90s TAS, and the list goes on and on. This is why it even filters into the movies. Those animated properties were the exposure many writers and directors had as children too. You can see influences of them scattered across the board like how Raimi had influences of the 90s spidey TAS in his movies(Black Cat was set to be in his Spidey 4, and it may have built up to Morbius too while handling vulture as the villian), while Marc Webb has more influences from the Spectacular Spider-man series besides the ultimate comics mixed with 616.

It's why we're more likely to see a Doctor Strange movie before many other obscure characters from Marvel. His 70s movie still lingers in the minds of many because of that exposure.

It also shows though that any obscure can become a mainstay and popular with the right exposure or film behind them. Any character can become a collector or kid favorite because of how they are presented and it's not limited to already having had past exposure to the public(an example for me is that I was never a black widow fan, the character was boring to me, until ScarJo's portrayal made that character epic and the new comic keeps that perfect sassy flair going). So it's a trade off and balancing act in itself. The key no matter what though is that exposure and visibility to make audiences aware of who that character is and leave a lasting impression that sticks with the audience.

Rebooting isn't the answer though. In fact I still maintain that barring special circumstances (*cough* when you Batman & Robin a franchise *cough*) there really isn't a need for reboots with the films. A lazy writer is the one that starts from a clean slate instead of finding ways to create a good story from what's available and staying true to the history and characters. X-Men as a cinematic universe still has much that can be told and done before a reboot would ever need to be approached. The same can be said of all the current Marvel lineups across the board. Even Amazing Spider-man didn't need to be done, but now that it has been rebooted as such, hopefully they'll stick to this one instead of scrapping plans(Raimi's trilogy originally would have given birth to a Venom spin-off too until the reboot pushed all those plans back again). The same could be said of fantastic 4 as the two stories told finally set up the potential to dive deeper into the characters themselves in a third installment(the original Silver Surfer spin-off plan was decent too and would have corrected the Galactus cloud/Shadow). The third installment of that should have handled a threat from the depths of the earth to counter balance the second movie's depths of space threat. So Moleman and more would have worked wonders there. Instead the reboot will potentially tread on material already covered yet again. The name of the game is serial films that can standalone but also contribute to a larger picture. Straight up standalone features without the serial ties potential hinder the overall development of these as a cinematic universe. Now that's not to say it can't be both. Some characters like Gambit, X-23, Black Cat, Venom, Sinister 6, and more can be standalone and still contribute to the cinematic universe as a whole by showing exactly how diverse and expansive the universe is by itself. These can still be comic accurate in soul while being detached from the mainstay titling by simply being good movies in themselves. At most only small nods of 'yes this exists in this world' is all that's needed. Minor newspaper headlines, news reports, referencing events, and there are many more techniques than that to maintain the canon but still starting fresh with these characters to show it can be done with the comic soul intact yet still in a realistic world that's been defined by previous films.

Thanks for the 'cold' truth Iceman and Snowflakian, you both have very valid points that I agree with whole heartedly.

As to Iceman's point about kids having to much material at hand these days to maintain for example, collecting action figures. Are we getting a glimpse of the future with 3D printers that say, if a kid actually wanted to make his own, or does a tangible 'hero', beit video game, super hero or other even appeal to children in 10 years from now? Or less?

With movies now, our childhood cartoons are living and breathing, and of course that's a perfect time for toy companies to collect. However, my gf's son thinks SW 6" figures are so cool and whatnot, but doesn't want to open them, in hopes they may be valuable or likely has little to no interest in the posing or handling. He's 13, and all his pals swoon over his figs, but for about 5 minutes and then on to 'video gaming' in some form.

Could we be the peak of action figure collecting? Is this the apex of the hobby? I know that interests fade and reappear in time for certain things, but....

just to add...with all the talk on the articulation aspect...for those who are saying the Spiderman line has crappy articulation yet still sold fairly well at $20 bucks a pop...I don't see Hasbro,Disney or Mattel increasing articulation and staying at the $20 pricepoint.

Interesting conversation you guys have going here...While I am not a fan of "movie" themed superhero figs, I do appreciate the introduction this sort of fanfare can create for an industry I've been closely tethered to since my early childhood.

I honestly can't remember the order of my interests as a child. Cartoons, comics, and toys of all genres were equally mesmerizing to me. I remember being captivated by 60's era superhero cartoons (which were in syndication by the time I saw them in the late 70's early 80's) like Spiderman, Iron Man, the Hulk, Thor, Cap, Aquaman & Aqualad, Supes, and Bats. There were so many choices; Hanna Barbera and Filmation made a bevy of different superhero themed shows and even offered their own characters like Space Ghost, The Herculoids, and Galaxy Trio. My first comics were Spiderman (I remember being afraid of Morbius and Lightmaster- those were my introductory Spidey villains), X-men (at the time, they were fighting Dracula who was in love with Storm and wanted to wed her - who wouldn't lol), the Hulk (who was fighting the Wendigo - who also scared the shit out of me), and Rom the Spaceknight. I was initially indiscriminate as it pertained to toys. I had Godzilla toys, Shogun Warriors, Star Wars figs, He-Man figs (and a bunch of weird He-man-like knock-off's they sold at the time - the 80's were weird that way), Black Hole figs, Tron figs, Six Million Dollar Man figs (Bionic-man), Battlestar Galactica, Buck Rogers figs and the list goes on....Figures were always the mainstay of toys for me and the influences for what I collected (or what my parents bought me) were a mixture of superheroe comics, sci-fi movies and TV shows. I think as I became more invested in comics, my scope narrowed. Additionally, at the time, the offerings for super-hero themed toys weren't that great (Kenner's Super-Powers figs and Mattel's Secret Wars figs), making it easier to relegate my pursuits to reading Marvel/DC comics and watching the complimentary toons about them.

Whatever the source or jump-off point for an interest in collecting superhero figures may be is not as important to me as is the cultivation of said interest to begin with. Come one...come all! As long as there is a market for these figs, they will keep making them. Toy figures have been being made for almost as long as civilization has existed. Anthropologists dig up ancient toy artifacts as much as they do any other artifact of antiquity. Although we are moving at an increasingly fast clip into the digital age (some would say exponentially so), there will always be a market for toy action figures. When I compare a child of today with myself as a kid, of course I must acknowledge that there are more "things to do" than when I was young. But I can't help but notice that toys and figures are more prevalent and popular than they have been at any other point in my life's experience. I see colleagues at work with toy action figures on their desks. I see people with miniature action figures hanging from key chains and bags. You can find a figure for almost any element of pop culture. Even if children move away from figs en masse, there is arguably an adult culture that would fill any void. In NYC there is a popular and locally famous toy-store called Toy Tokyo. I go there frequently. I take friends there that visit the area. I have rarely seen a child in this well-known toystore. I think I have seen kids in there (a grand total of) two times. One of those times, the kids in question, were the children of a friend I had brought there. Suffice it to say, this store is frequented by mostly adult clientele and it does very well....If they didn't (do well), they wouldn't be able to afford to lease space in the East Village of Manhattan. The niche culture of toy figure collecting has blossomed into a phenomenon that will endure. Hell, its been enduring for quite a long time.

My take on the figure collecting for 'adults' has always been that it's the same as statue collecting, only cheaper and better.
Better because you can change your display as you please and let it grow as you like dynamically, whereas a statue is stuck in only that pose and may not always combine well with other statues as display pieces. A figure display can evolve and be changed on the fly. Statues cannot. So overall with the cheaper cost, you're really getting more out of it.

it is a good thing we dont have to pay-per-word for these responses!

I feel like I just read War And Peace catching up on this thread!!! ;)

I could not have expressed that sentiment any better. You have captured exactly why I, as an adult, maintain a collection of figures. Although I believe in a higher power (so the following is not necessarily my opinion of myself), some believe that superhero fanfare is a modern from of mythmaking similar to the way ancient civilizations worshiped the demi-gods of various pantheons. Even though I don't subscribe to that train of thought, I can recognize that I have surround myself with these poseable statues of heroes and heroines of a more modern lore....not unlike the ancient Egyptians, Greeks, and Romans. It really is funny that you should express what you did. A good college buddy of mine always remarks to me about the awesomeness of the Bowen design statues. He has always known that I collect figs and we are both comic fans. I believe, in a way to relate to my collecting, he often speaks to me of how he would collect superhero statues if they weren't so damn expensive. I, of course, always encourage him that action figures are a more than viable alternative. The cost is much more reasonable. The sculpts can be equally engaging. The size (6 inch - my chosen indulgence) permits large collections (if kept loose) with minimal cost in physical space (again if kept loose in storage containers or boxes). Additionally, one has the benefit of posing them dynamically and mixing and matching based on personal flights of fancy. I don't want to detract from the spectacular superhero statues that I see all the time...they can really be amazing! I just believe that figs offer a little of everything.

If Hasbro does not take up the task and you know, PRODUCE MARVEL FIGURES, what alternative is there to movie figures?

I was hoping the reason they jacked the SRP to 25 dollars was for a BAF Sentinel or Nimrod or something other than a reused Hulk body for goblin and a retooled Iron Monger for Mandroid. But they have refused to do any X-Men merech, I can only speculate that they are afraid of giving fans a big BAF that we all would expect.

I really hope fans take them to task and hold their feet to the fire over the X-Men movie figures. I still want my SIlver Samurai, I'm surprised Hasbro didn't just retool Iron Monger....lol

Really, that's the only explanation you can think of? I can only hope that your post was sarcasm and I just missed it due to this medium.

Waving your little stick, and it shows your response has nothing of value in it. You can explain and show me my errors in what i implied. Please by all means.

PS: I cannot believe i misspelled "merch."

am I hearing you correct? the next wave...the jubuildafigurelee is $24.99 a pop?? wow if that holds up to be true I may actually hafta cut out some lines. We are a long way away from the 8.99-9.99 point these figures use to be at but damn...oil and plastic aint that much...gas has been 3.35 for a good minute now yet these little plastic bundles of joy continue to go up in price almost weekly(TRU). So the only question I actually have is: What happens when we all say that $25 bucks for an under articulated figure is too much? Especially since that pricepoint is MS territory,

don't worry, TRU always over prices everything, then in a few months when it isn't moving they will drop the price from 25 to 2.50. they seem to defy logic, there either ripping you off or giving stuff away. look at the LUB MU figures, they started at like 20, now there 5.

We have to worry since Hasbro increased the SRP of legends to $20, TRU upped it to 23 in NY. Now if its a TRU exclusive,i expect it to be around 27 in NYC area.

We are paying so much, it has tripled in cost in just four years, the cost of legends had surpassed inflation dramatically, yet no big baf and less accessories, less joints, no articulated hands, no bases, nothing.

Hasbro has really done a disservice to collectors. Remember when they canceled legends and I'm in full panic mode over the cost they ask, for less.

well TRU charges 22.99 for ML here in KC only ones that held the same retail so far are the SWB series at 19.99
I wonder how long that will last though

inflation and production costs are two different things, grant it production cost is a factor that drives inflation, but look at your local grocery store, everything is going up and cutting back, I'll use coffee for example, they pulled a three tier price rise over the last two years (this is a common tactic to distract the public) step 1: very small price increase, you barley notice, step 2: redesigned packaging/temporary price cut this is usually touted as "environmentally friendly" or "green" packaging as to make the consumer think the product and company are heartfelt and caring, when in fact the new package, wile being about the same size as the original, contains 15% less coffee, the temporary price cut is so you stay loyal to the brand and to attract new consumers. step 3: raise the price back to normal thus selling you less product for a higher price over an extended period without most consumers ever noticing. every product does this. This is why your grandpa tells you that for a buffalo nickel he use to get ten funny books, a bag of candy and a hooker. everything goes up! your dollar is worth less every day.

I actually agree with that...Well said!

I did notice... especially on laundry detergent...it was way too obvious... but what do you do when everyone else follows suit...

Some of the big thing Hasbro does is packagingredesigns. They love to it to win awards. Recycled boxes are expensive and Hasbro loves winning awards for packages.

A lot of the cost Hasbro phases to consumers is for the new all black legends boxes and black series boxes. To won awards, Hasbro passes the cost to consumers and no, no corporations do not care about the environment, just awards and publicity that comes with it.

there's awards for packaging? I was not aware of that. I think packaging is ancillary to the product, more or less there to attract the consumer, but there is a balance to be struck so the consumer isn't paying for the box instead of the contents. I do think environmentally friendly packaging is more to appeal to the consumer than to save the planet.

Refreshing packaging is also to keep the retailers interested in a line that might be running out of steam or to hook in new retailers to increase sales.

I didn't feel I needed to go into detail again, especially since it was already covered in this and other threads within this forum. But since you insist, here's the short and skinny:

1. There is an immediate flaw in your logic to assume that Hasbro is out to "get" you, or fan/collectors in general. As if they are this faceless, evil entity that has some sort of agenda fueled by schadenfreude. I have noticed this apparent attitude in several of your posts.

2. Why would Hasbro be afraid to make a toy if they knew it would sell? They're in the business to make money, so avoiding an opportunity like that seems highly counter-productive - particularly for one of the largest toy companies in the world.

3. I also question the logic behind your suggestion that Hasbro's decision to not make a toy line for DOFP was based on the inclusion or absence of a BAF.

4. As I have said previously, it is entirely possible that the Marvel team within Hasbro had too many other projects to work on for this year and had to make a call. X-Men movie toys do not have that great of a track record at retail, so if their workload was a factor then the least marketable IP (in their eyes, not ours) would get the ax.

5. Another possible reason that has also been suggested already is that it would cost Hasbro more to produce figures based on the X-Men movies due to paying additional licensing fees to the studio, the actors or both.

But hey, you're free to believe whatever you want. Just don't be surprised if others disagree from time to time.

I guess that's why you can buy packaging on ebay for damn near the cost of the item and the packaging. Seems there is a market for empty boxes and inserts

I get that everyone has there thing, but empty packages? is that a thing now? maybe if I had a 60's GI Joe or a G1 transformer that didn't have a box or the old Joe file cards, but I really don't think I would want empty boxes or modern MU cards without the figure, hell I throw mine away after opening them, I'm not going out of my way to buy them.

yes there is unfortunately. I like you throw away the unnecessary packaging. Maybe sometime keep the card packs or inserts but yeah...packaging is gone.

look at these 3 links and see how crazy it is

Playmates Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles Classics Empty Package Lot | eBay
Transformers Masterpiece Soundwave Package from Tru Exclusive Empty Box Tray | eBay

empty packaging in Toys & Hobbies | eBay

I was pleasntly surprised to see another X-Men line so soon after the Wolverine legends, less happy to see it at TRU, but it is what it is and hopefully it will be on TRU.ca.

I'm not sure about those packaged pics we have seen on marvelousnews just yet though. The ASM2 and Cap2 lines offered extra hands and heads or guns. RoML Mystique and Punisher came with arsenals. Of course not every figure will have extras, but IMO if Magneto's helmet isn't removable, he should have the extra head sans helmet, and possibly the same for Stryfe.

Add-ons like BAF parts are a bonus, if we get them great, but it won't always be the case I'm sure. We got stands with one wave, they weren't the greatest, but they were 'something', if in the future Hasbro wants to pack in a stand I hope its just a flat disc with a peg.

I wonder if this next X wave will be $30 + tax up here...yikes!

BTW I hate store exclusives!!