Integration

Warthog76 · 10-19-2009, 08:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shin Densetsu

$100 is a stretch, I highly doubt a 32X Tomcat would go for that price. $60 is more reasonable, that's the price BBI's Phantom went for, and that one was an online exclusive that never went to the big 3(Walmart, TRU, Target). Not to mention both aircraft are similar in size, it's not like an F/A-18 compared to an F-14, where one is way smaller than the other.1/18 won't end anytime soon for JSI, and 32X products will not get in the way of their 1/18 products, it never did when 21st made both 1/18 XD and 32X products. 32X isn't something for release immediately.

Hell they were planning both 32X and 1/18 XD Phantoms when the Phantom was announced at Toy Fair 2007.
Fame Master's F-14 costs $150 because of the high amount of small parts. The higher the amount of small parts, the higher the tooling cost for the molds. I have that model and you guys would not believe how many pieces it comes with. Sure at 1/32 scale, the Tomcat is not a giant but the amount of parts is the most I have ever seen for a pre-painted 1/32 model. Tamiya's Tomcats go for high prices because the amount of parts as well.

I wouldn't sell a 1/32 scale jet like the F-14 Tomcat short on being more than a $60 price tag. It has complexity to it that the F-4 doesn't. bbi's SBD, which was an internet exclusive only item, sold for around $50 and it was half the size. It was rumored that if Admiral Toys had gone into the 1/32 scale market with their Kate, it would have been selling for least $45-$50.

Quote:

Both planes appeal to fans as well, because they are unique, and because their supposed successors cannot do the job the same way that they can. For example, the F-35A will take on the A-10's role when it's retired but it can't do the job as well as the A-10. The F-16 was tested with a 30mm gunpod in order to see if it was a feasible replacement; it wasn't.

The A-10 is planned to be retired until 2028. That will give it one of the longest service time records for any military aircraft. Who knows what will change in that time frame. They may increase its service life even further, but I doubt it will be shortened.

Quote:

Oh believe me, they know.

I'm glad to hear they know....everyone before them has said that and look what the fans/collectors have recieved.....JSI needs to do something with that knowledge and set themselves apart in the "we listen to the fans and care about what they want department"....make an A-10 in 1/18 scale for the fans/collectors.

Not trying to rant or come across in a bad way, but part of the main problems that has been created in the 1/18 scale hobby is fans/collectors being told they are being listened to and want to give them what they want, but then the products that are produced aren't what is being asked for by the majority. This has lead to alot of disinterests and loss of collectors/fans.

Quote:

That's just the thing; as JSI and longtime XD fans remember, the competition is very quiet. JSI does not want overlap. 21st Century Toys was a big learning lesson for them. I don't think ANYONE is happy with what happened after Toy Fair 2007; a 1/18 Phantom announced by 2 entirely different companies and 2 years later STILL no Phantom. The Phantom was not the only time that both companies planned to release the same aircraft. The ME-262 and F-86 Sabre come to mind. Hell even the Mosquito, it wasn't a big secret that Roy Sutherland, CEO of 21st was a huge fan of the Mosquito. The WWII fans wanted it, and years later who announced plans for it when 21st was gone? Admiral Toys.

After following the 1/18 scale boards for years, I've assessed this. The whole thing with the F-4 was due to the non-communication between Admiral and 21st. Jason with Admiral Toys commented several times about their talks with bbi and how they both communicated to prevent mishaps of releasing the same subjects. Jason with Admiral Toys has also stated on one board that his people in China had communications with JSI before JSI was even known to collectors. This tells me that we should have players in the field now that are willing to work with eachother.

Quote:

I don't think they will. They strive to outdo themselves, chances are, as good as the Tomcat will turn out, the Flanker and Eagle will probably surpass it. They do not want to live in 21st Century's shadow, they know 21st Century Toys had suspect quality control.

I hope they don't either, but just because they are producing an F-14 Tomcat in 1/18 scale doesn't mean they won't. I have renewed hope for modern jet in 1/18 scale, I just hope JSI listens to fans and produces the ones that fans want, not ones that aren't even on the radar.

Quote:

One thing to consider to, is how much you guys would be willing to pay for an A-10. I think it's a worthy addition to the 1/18 line but like the Tomcat, it is a large aircraft, and has several weapons. Right off the bat I would say there are at least 4 releases we can speculate about:

green European camo w/sharkmouth
green European camo
gray
gray w/sharkmouth

Some of the gray ones with retooling can be released as OA-10A's. The sharkmouth is iconic, and the green camo is very popular; it's the camo most people saw the A-10 painted in when it entered service. I predict that an A-10 would be in the $150-200 range, depending on how many weapons are included.

It is definitely a worthy addition to the 1/18 scale line. The onley true CAS aircraft. It's a large aircraft, but not any larger than the F-14 or Su-27. It's also a simpler aircraft to make in relation to the F-14. Like I've read on many posts from other boards, it has no complex swing wing, simple landing gear, and one cockpit (which means one less figure to add to the cost). Yes it has alot of ordinance, but if JSI were to go for true accuracy, an A-10 wouldn't be loaded down like you see it most of the time with models. Two sidewinders, one or two AGM-65 Mavericks on each wing, and two 500lb. bombs would cover one of the normal load outs. That's what, 8 weapons and the F-14 they are producing has the same plus fuel tanks. Extra ordinance and the correct attachments and ordinance could be sold in a seperate package. I wouldn't even bother with external fuel tanks except to put them in a extra package.

The schemes you mentioned I agree would be the primary ones to make and the top sellers. However, you wouldn't have to re-tool anything to release an A-10A as on OA-10 version. They are the same exact platform in everyway except for odinance loadout.....again...seperate weapons packages could be sold to meet this. Even an A-10A model could be passed off as an A-10C model almost. Retooling of the cockpit interior, glass cockpit instead of gauges and dials, and the addition of one or two antennas is all that is needed to make the mold an A versus a C.

Kind of a mute point to wonder how much collectors/fans are willing to pay for a 1/18 scale A-10 in my opinion. With sale of the F-14 apparently doing very well from retailer comments, I think fans/collectors have made a statement that they are willing to purchase 1/18 scale jets they truly want that fall in this price range. With the F-14 selling for roughly $225, I don't think there is any reason why JSI could not produce an A-10 in 1/18 scale that would be at or under this price. I would like to think it could be sold under that price. An A-10 built to the same standards as JSI's F-14 would be a steal for that price range. Fans/Collectors I know would support it if JSI will listen to them and make it.

I hope we see great things from JSI....

10-19-2009, 08:26 AM	#27
Warthog76 Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 13	Quote: Originally Posted by Shin Densetsu $100 is a stretch, I highly doubt a 32X Tomcat would go for that price. $60 is more reasonable, that's the price BBI's Phantom went for, and that one was an online exclusive that never went to the big 3(Walmart, TRU, Target). Not to mention both aircraft are similar in size, it's not like an F/A-18 compared to an F-14, where one is way smaller than the other.1/18 won't end anytime soon for JSI, and 32X products will not get in the way of their 1/18 products, it never did when 21st made both 1/18 XD and 32X products. 32X isn't something for release immediately. Hell they were planning both 32X and 1/18 XD Phantoms when the Phantom was announced at Toy Fair 2007. Fame Master's F-14 costs $150 because of the high amount of small parts. The higher the amount of small parts, the higher the tooling cost for the molds. I have that model and you guys would not believe how many pieces it comes with. Sure at 1/32 scale, the Tomcat is not a giant but the amount of parts is the most I have ever seen for a pre-painted 1/32 model. Tamiya's Tomcats go for high prices because the amount of parts as well. I wouldn't sell a 1/32 scale jet like the F-14 Tomcat short on being more than a $60 price tag. It has complexity to it that the F-4 doesn't. bbi's SBD, which was an internet exclusive only item, sold for around $50 and it was half the size. It was rumored that if Admiral Toys had gone into the 1/32 scale market with their Kate, it would have been selling for least $45-$50. Quote: Both planes appeal to fans as well, because they are unique, and because their supposed successors cannot do the job the same way that they can. For example, the F-35A will take on the A-10's role when it's retired but it can't do the job as well as the A-10. The F-16 was tested with a 30mm gunpod in order to see if it was a feasible replacement; it wasn't. The A-10 is planned to be retired until 2028. That will give it one of the longest service time records for any military aircraft. Who knows what will change in that time frame. They may increase its service life even further, but I doubt it will be shortened. Quote: Oh believe me, they know. I'm glad to hear they know....everyone before them has said that and look what the fans/collectors have recieved.....JSI needs to do something with that knowledge and set themselves apart in the "we listen to the fans and care about what they want department"....make an A-10 in 1/18 scale for the fans/collectors. Not trying to rant or come across in a bad way, but part of the main problems that has been created in the 1/18 scale hobby is fans/collectors being told they are being listened to and want to give them what they want, but then the products that are produced aren't what is being asked for by the majority. This has lead to alot of disinterests and loss of collectors/fans. Quote: That's just the thing; as JSI and longtime XD fans remember, the competition is very quiet. JSI does not want overlap. 21st Century Toys was a big learning lesson for them. I don't think ANYONE is happy with what happened after Toy Fair 2007; a 1/18 Phantom announced by 2 entirely different companies and 2 years later STILL no Phantom. The Phantom was not the only time that both companies planned to release the same aircraft. The ME-262 and F-86 Sabre come to mind. Hell even the Mosquito, it wasn't a big secret that Roy Sutherland, CEO of 21st was a huge fan of the Mosquito. The WWII fans wanted it, and years later who announced plans for it when 21st was gone? Admiral Toys. After following the 1/18 scale boards for years, I've assessed this. The whole thing with the F-4 was due to the non-communication between Admiral and 21st. Jason with Admiral Toys commented several times about their talks with bbi and how they both communicated to prevent mishaps of releasing the same subjects. Jason with Admiral Toys has also stated on one board that his people in China had communications with JSI before JSI was even known to collectors. This tells me that we should have players in the field now that are willing to work with eachother. Quote: I don't think they will. They strive to outdo themselves, chances are, as good as the Tomcat will turn out, the Flanker and Eagle will probably surpass it. They do not want to live in 21st Century's shadow, they know 21st Century Toys had suspect quality control. I hope they don't either, but just because they are producing an F-14 Tomcat in 1/18 scale doesn't mean they won't. I have renewed hope for modern jet in 1/18 scale, I just hope JSI listens to fans and produces the ones that fans want, not ones that aren't even on the radar. Quote: One thing to consider to, is how much you guys would be willing to pay for an A-10. I think it's a worthy addition to the 1/18 line but like the Tomcat, it is a large aircraft, and has several weapons. Right off the bat I would say there are at least 4 releases we can speculate about: green European camo w/sharkmouth green European camo gray gray w/sharkmouth Some of the gray ones with retooling can be released as OA-10A's. The sharkmouth is iconic, and the green camo is very popular; it's the camo most people saw the A-10 painted in when it entered service. I predict that an A-10 would be in the $150-200 range, depending on how many weapons are included. It is definitely a worthy addition to the 1/18 scale line. The onley true CAS aircraft. It's a large aircraft, but not any larger than the F-14 or Su-27. It's also a simpler aircraft to make in relation to the F-14. Like I've read on many posts from other boards, it has no complex swing wing, simple landing gear, and one cockpit (which means one less figure to add to the cost). Yes it has alot of ordinance, but if JSI were to go for true accuracy, an A-10 wouldn't be loaded down like you see it most of the time with models. Two sidewinders, one or two AGM-65 Mavericks on each wing, and two 500lb. bombs would cover one of the normal load outs. That's what, 8 weapons and the F-14 they are producing has the same plus fuel tanks. Extra ordinance and the correct attachments and ordinance could be sold in a seperate package. I wouldn't even bother with external fuel tanks except to put them in a extra package. The schemes you mentioned I agree would be the primary ones to make and the top sellers. However, you wouldn't have to re-tool anything to release an A-10A as on OA-10 version. They are the same exact platform in everyway except for odinance loadout.....again...seperate weapons packages could be sold to meet this. Even an A-10A model could be passed off as an A-10C model almost. Retooling of the cockpit interior, glass cockpit instead of gauges and dials, and the addition of one or two antennas is all that is needed to make the mold an A versus a C. Kind of a mute point to wonder how much collectors/fans are willing to pay for a 1/18 scale A-10 in my opinion. With sale of the F-14 apparently doing very well from retailer comments, I think fans/collectors have made a statement that they are willing to purchase 1/18 scale jets they truly want that fall in this price range. With the F-14 selling for roughly $225, I don't think there is any reason why JSI could not produce an A-10 in 1/18 scale that would be at or under this price. I would like to think it could be sold under that price. An A-10 built to the same standards as JSI's F-14 would be a steal for that price range. Fans/Collectors I know would support it if JSI will listen to them and make it. I hope we see great things from JSI....