[Snowflakian]

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheBlueMarvel

@Greg

@Snowflakian

I accept your opinion of Identity Crisis as tasteless given the subject matter and that continued debate of its merits changes this conversation. However, I’d like to extend a thought to you in defense of the story. History has taught its observers that both villains and heroes are capable of monstrous acts. With that in mind, why not portray superheroes and super-villains as being just as capable of monstrosities? This is just a rhetorical question with no right or wrong answer.

I agree with the comparative point that it humanizes the heroes and villains to show monstrous acts etc. And from a literature standpoint that makes sense to a degree. I have an issue with it using rape though as a plot point in general. There's a thin line of story device, and explicit for explicit's sake, and in this instance, I personally lean on it was explicit for explicit's sake and not for any form of art form reasons. The main draw of which being the shock factor simply to shock and not to elaborate on any set point other than to shock the reader.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trivial Psychic

Let's not forget that one of the hottest series of toys on the market today TMNT, which, in celebration of their 30th anniversary, released versions of their figures celebrating their classic Mirage comic appearances. Bear in mind that those comic version of the turtles were far from lovable reptiles we know today, but where in fact a bunch of jerks who smoked, drank, swore, and were not afraid to kill. They were essentially hit men who were trained not necessarily to fight crime, but to kill the Shredder and his followers in a plot of revenge from their rat master.

Other characters who have been in less than favorable situations that would make the average parent cringe if they knew more...
-Venom (Attempted rape/ Eddie Brock / "The Madness")
-Harry Osborn (drug addict)
-Black Cat (raped)
-Marvel's poster boy the last ten years, Iron Man (alcoholic).

Let's not forget the character that Marvel is banking big on next year...Ant Man (alcoholic, domestic violence)

And just curious...Didn't one of Batman's most idolized rogues, The Joker, also rape Barbara Gordon? It's been a while since I've read "The Killing Joke", but I've always interpreted it that it was an act he carried out after shooting her, given the nature of his taunts to Commissioner Gordon. The fact that I wouldn't put it beyond Frank Miller for him to actually intend for the character to do such a despicable thing also rings out in my mind.

As for the other comments towards figures, it varies.

I would not say ban toys at all though, and especially not say ban fictional character victims. A survivor of an ordeal should not be demonized the same as a perpetrator. A perpetrator of an act is entirely different though, I would find it hard to argue if figures of such characters were hesitant to reach market and would almost agree with them being set aside as better off not made. Characters that were victims though should not be in the same category as those who commit such acts. Survivors need representation in media for the aspects of not letting the incidents control their lives and give them hope for a better tomorrow. Perpetrators of the acts don't. Glorifying them in such manners is highly problematic.

As for Ant-Man... This is why Marvel has a heavy push on Lang and O'Grady instead. Lang may have been a criminal but he also turned his life around. O'Grady may have been a slacker and perv, but he also turned his life around to become a hero. This makes them advocates for how people can change for the better and be rehabilitated to help society.

Pym on the other hand... Then we get into complicated territory. The movie focuses on Lang though, and has re-written Pym's story so the domestic violence aspect isn't there anymore.

So I'd agree possibly on Joker or Eddie Brock or whoever assaulted Black Cat not having a figure or being barred from TRU.
But Black Cat and Bat Girl, the act committed against them should not ever be a reason to ban their figures. All that does is instead glorify the blame the victim mentality by using acts committed against them as reasons to hold them down further. That's a disgusting notion to even suggest.