Transformer Questions

Tarquinius · 10-20-2010, 06:57 PM

Ok guys....so many of you who have known me have known that I primarily dabble in Marvel Universe, I'm like 100% complete in the line and 80% complete in all of the companion lines. But recently I've been bored waiting for stuff to come out and I've been walking up and down the toy aisle dabbling in some other lines: 2010 GI Joe, DCIH (lil late for that..) and now I've gotten to Transformers....

So I come here, probably the greatest resource for Transformers and I have questions questions questions. First off the bat, let me say that I do not intend to collect every figure of this line and I know virtually nothing about the Transformer mythos, so I'm just picking up stuff that looks cool.

SOOOOOOOO Somebody!! Help me develop a schema for the Transformers line. I know that this line is huge and it stems all the way back to the 80's. What I'm primarily interested in is understanding the dynamics of the toyline since the second movie

It seems like that Revenge of the Fallen toys were very big and in some facet they still continue.

So am I right in guessing this?

There are three current toylines (I'm excluding the fast combiners and weird gimicky shit like that)

Transformers Revenge of the Fallen (red packaging)

Transformers Pursuit of the Deceptacons (gold packaging)

Transformers Generations (red packaging)

In each line they divide it between deluxe figures (which seem to be basic), power core combiners, combiners, leaders etc.

Can someone pleeease elaborate on this for me? I've only been picking up Generations toys (both deluxe and power core) which I LOVE. But its obvious the other lines supplement each other, so can someone please give me detailed examples of the lines with figures that have appeared exclusively in the line?

Teach me your ways!

Superquad7 · 10-21-2010, 01:18 AM

It sounds to me like you're already gotten a pretty decent handle on things. Revenge of the Fallen is fairly self-contained. The Hunt for the Decepticons line is a bit of a continuation of it, but it's made to be just a little more generic so that Hasbro can make figures like Seaspray that weren't in the movie. This especially helps out the Generations line, which is all deluxe-sized.

Since you say that you're enjoying the Generations line so much, I'd highly recommend looking into getting some earlier released figures (despite that going against your pre-RotF plan a bit). The reason for this is that Generations is a continuation of Classics. Note that Classics originally was to be a brief line, but Hasbro ended up continuing it with Universe 2.0, and now Generations. While each of these are, technically, separate lines, they are made to fit in with each other.

Also noteworthy is that Generations and Hunt for the Decepticons will soon be making the transition to Reveal the Shield in 2011. For movie-styled toys, RtS will have a few of those, but the third movie will see a major reboot with that type of figure.

I hope that helps some

Tarquinius · 10-21-2010, 04:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by superquad7

It sounds to me like you're already gotten a pretty decent handle on things. Revenge of the Fallen is fairly self-contained. The Hunt for the Decepticons line is a bit of a continuation of it, but it's made to be just a little more generic so that Hasbro can make figures like Seaspray that weren't in the movie. This especially helps out the Generations line, which is all deluxe-sized.

Since you say that you're enjoying the Generations line so much, I'd highly recommend looking into getting some earlier released figures (despite that going against your pre-RotF plan a bit). The reason for this is that Generations is a continuation of Classics. Note that Classics originally was to be a brief line, but Hasbro ended up continuing it with Universe 2.0, and now Generations. While each of these are, technically, separate lines, they are made to fit in with each other.

Also noteworthy is that Generations and Hunt for the Decepticons will soon be making the transition to Reveal the Shield in 2011. For movie-styled toys, RtS will have a few of those, but the third movie will see a major reboot with that type of figure.

I hope that helps some

Yes!!! IT definitely does.

So let me attempt to paraphrase what you said

ROTF Movie line is basically self contained within the movie and features "movie figures"

Generations is a continuation of a previous line called Classics which then evolved into Universe 2.0 (So it goes classics-universe 2.0-generations)

Hunt for Deceptacons goes either way, it just being its own line which has movie esque figures but may have one or two random ones thrown in there which would supplement the Classic/Generation theme.

Is this right so far?

Can you explain to me RtS a bit more? You're saying that the two lines will merge into this line and become a movie line for the upcoming third movie?

nakobass · 10-21-2010, 05:25 AM

Reveal the Shield will combine most of the lines together until the 3rd Transformers Movie comes around, then they will probably separate the movie figures again into another line for the movie, leaving the RTS for the more 80's G1 Based Transformers.

I only collect Transformers I personally like or some of my favorite characters. Really looking forward to Jazz, Wheeljack, Perceptor, and Tracks coming out. These are all based on 80's Transformers and will go fast, so be on the look out. Toysrus is the place to look for early releases. I already got Generations Megatron and Soundwave. I hope that helps a little.

MegaPrime33 · 10-21-2010, 06:37 AM

As a big fan of Transformers, I have to say that I have not been too interested in any of the lines since Armada. Anything after that, to me, seemed to be geared more to kids and have more of a playskool look. If you're at all interested in some of the older lines, and depending on what you prefer, I would say Robots in Disguise would be a nice starting point. Beast Wars is good, but Transformers is most known for vehicles, not animals, so RID is definitely great.

trebleshot · 10-21-2010, 07:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tarquinius

ROTF Movie line is basically self contained within the movie and features "movie figures"

Yes, to a point. It is self-contained in that it has movie toys and off-screen "movie" characters, but nothing that strayed too far outside that universe and design aesthetic. The last wave or so began to show the direction that HTFD would go, with more blended aesthetics that blurred the line between movie and non-movie styling.

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Generations is a continuation of a previous line called Classics which then evolved into Universe 2.0 (So it goes classics-universe 2.0-generations)

Exactly correct. Generations is also a little broader than its predecessors since it not only has "classic"-style designs, it also has other niche stuff like toys based on the War For Cybertron video games.

And technically, Power Core Combiners is its own separate subline and not part of Generations. It's in the same red packaging, but does not bear the "Generations" tag under the TF logo. It has a PCC logo instead.

Quote:

Hunt for Deceptacons goes either way, it just being its own line which has movie esque figures but may have one or two random ones thrown in there which would supplement the Classic/Generation theme.

Also correct. HFTD is to Revenge of the Fallen as Pursuit of Cobra was to Rise of Cobra. Basically it's a transitional line that contains the movie stuff with a few toys that could easily display with Classics or Movie toys. Eventually it will become RTS, which will lead into The Dark of the Moon toy line (aka TF3).

As for what to look for, nostalgia plays a big factor for most TF collectors. But on toy merits alone, here are a few to check out for each line. Keep in mind, all of these suggestions are based on toys I actually own:

Generations: Get pretty much everything in this line. Probably one of the best lines Hasbro has done in years and it continues the excellent work done for Classics and Universe 2.0. To give you an idea, Generations Thrust is a remold/redeco of Classics Starscream (one of many remold/repaints out there) and Generations Red Alert is a remold/redeco of Universe 2.0 Sideswipe (which is also used to make Sunstreaker, but with a clever twist on reusing the mold. Sunstreaker came first, btw). Also, the WFC toys are great, especially Soundwave and Prime (haven't found Megs yet).

Power Core Combiners: Some of these are hit-or-miss for me. Nothing horrible, but some aren't that special. So far my favorites are Bombshock (although watch the Jeep leg; connector point is a little loose), Leadfoot, Icepick and Smolder. Definitely get Leadfoot, if only for Pinpointer. Pinpointer is arguably the best Minicon ever made.

Revenge Of The Fallen: The entire scout class. Every one ranges from good to awesome. There are some redecos (a couple molds have 3 different paint schemes), but at the very least try to pick up one of each mold.

As for the larger classes, I'd recommend Autobot Skids and Mudflap, Brawn, Jetfire, Optimus Prime (Leader and Voyager), Recon Ironhide, Bludgeon, Lockdown, and Mindwipe. Leader-class Prime and Jetfire have a combined mode that is just massive and rivals Brave Series combiners for sheer bulk, plus it still has decent articulation!

Hunt For The Decepticons: The entire scout class again. Continued from ROTF, but new molds mixed in with the redecos. Other good picks include Legends Devastator (TRU Exclusive), Legends Ravage, Sea Spray, Ironhide, and Hailstorm.

Like nakobass said, there's even more goodness on the horizon for all three (four) lines. And definitely look into the older Classics/Universe 2.0 lines. There were some real gems in those two lines as well.

Tarquinius · 10-21-2010, 09:09 AM

Great answers guys!! I'm really getting into this thanks a lot

Few more questions

Went to TRU today and saw Grimlock which was TF Masterpiece? Where and how does this fit? Seems like a traditional character so I would want to say Generations/Classics/Universe.

I also saw the TRU Exclusive Universe Figures...and those ARE from the Universe line which leads into the Generations etc? Its not just pure coincidence that they have the same name?

And Pirahanacon off of BBTS...whats up with that? Again I have no idea about the mythos here but I know G1 was like...the first series/toyline? So its just a re-release of that?

Core-Combiners, are these in scale with anything else? I don't think so butcan someone help me here

And as far as older lines, (MegaPrime). I might be interested in checkign some of this stuff out, but I might need some more background information about the progression of the Transformers mythos as well as the toyline. How would you say the articulation, paint apps are for some of those lines? Always seemed to me that older transformers had minimal articulation

Furthermore, does anybody have any checklists for any and all TF lines? Thanks guys you are being very helpful

firmpulse · 10-21-2010, 09:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tarquinius

Went to TRU today and saw Grimlock which was TF Masterpiece? Where and how does this fit? Seems like a traditional character so I would want to say Generations/Classics/Universe.

MP's are a different division. they're really not in scale with one another (with the exception of prime and megatron). they are meant to be the ultimate expression of the g1 toy according to takaratomy.

i bought the takaratomy mp grim. i LOVE the toy. it's solid with a very smooth transformation. the tru hasbro version has some different paint apps, a little more vac metal and that's it. for 70 bucks i can't recommend it enough.

Shin Densetsu · 10-21-2010, 10:13 AM

Basically, the ROTF line featured some designs which were IIRC, meant for Classics 2.0 in 2008 but did not make it until ROTF, like Bludgeon. By the same token, Seaspray from HFTD IMHO, fits more in Classics than movie.

HFTD is primarily movie styling. Generations is primarily Classics styling. Both lines are merging into Reveal the Shield.

Power Core Combiners is its own line.

The Universe exclusive repaints(like Countdown and Bruticus) at TRU are seen as "close enough" by Hasbro to fit in with Universe/Classics 2.0.

Armada was a step back in articulation and was a gimmick line. So were Energon and Cybertron, but Cybertron was known for the return to full articulation for most figures, and some fans who despised Armada/Energon like Cybertron, like me. I loved Cybertron. Cybertron Prime is one of the BEST modern Prime figures ever made.

trebleshot · 10-21-2010, 12:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tarquinius

Few more questions

Went to TRU today and saw Grimlock which was TF Masterpiece? Where and how does this fit? Seems like a traditional character so I would want to say Generations/Classics/Universe.

Hasbro put him in the Generations line for the US release, but firmpulse is correct: he really belongs in the Masterpiece line (he was released in Japan first, with different accessories, paint apps, etc). I would have recommended it above, but I don't have him yet. He's on my must-buy list for certain. Plus, being a T-Rex, he actually does scale rather well with Classics toys from pics I've seen.

Quote:

I also saw the TRU Exclusive Universe Figures...and those ARE from the Universe line which leads into the Generations etc? Its not just pure coincidence that they have the same name?

Well, like Shin said, those are supposed to be part of Universe 2.0 (hence the packaging), but they're really redecos from previous lines that are "close enough" to fit in with the overall aesthetic of Classics/Universe 2.0. Oh, and TRU Darkwind is a redeco of Universe 2.0 Silverbolt (simplistic mold, but a lot of fun and character). There are also some Walmart exclusives done the same way (but they only use Universe 2.0 molds). Most of the exclusives are homages to G1 characters.

Actually, sometimes the exclusives can drive you batty if you're a completist or even a mold completist like me.

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And Pirahanacon off of BBTS...whats up with that? Again I have no idea about the mythos here but I know G1 was like...the first series/toyline? So its just a re-release of that?

Pirahnacon is a G1 reissue. And yes, G1 was the original TF toy line that ran from 1984-1990 in the US (through '92 in Europe and other countries). Also known as the Seacons, they were one of the last combiner teams released in G1 and arguably one of the best. All of the smaller ones are interchangeable in combined mode (each one can be an arm or a leg). And each one of those has the ability to transform from robot to creature to limb to hand-held weapon for the combined mode!

Definitely a good start if you want to jump down the G1 rabbit hole

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Core-Combiners, are these in scale with anything else? I don't think so butcan someone help me here

As I said, PCC is a separate line, so it's not in-scale with anything else. What it does have is the sheer amount of customization you can do with the combination gimmick. Any commander figure can be used with any combination of the drones. Plus the Minicon use a standard size peg/hole system making all the Minicons compatible too (even with older lines like Armada, Energon and Cybertron).

Quote:

And as far as older lines, (MegaPrime). I might be interested in checkign some of this stuff out, but I might need some more background information about the progression of the Transformers mythos as well as the toyline. How would you say the articulation, paint apps are for some of those lines? Always seemed to me that older transformers had minimal articulation

In general, G1 had the least amount of articulation (some only a couple of points total). As the brand got older, more articulation was added. Then Armada came and the gimmicks in that line practically killed or maimed any articulation the molds had. But since then, articulation has come back in a big way.

That's not to say there weren't a few awesome G1 toys back then that are still good now. Soundwave is a good example of this and probably the best mold in the first 2 waves of G1.

Paint apps have been relatively sparse through the years (G1 had stickers for its details), but for what they've had, it was good quality.

Fiction-wise, the TF Wiki and Wikipedia would give you the nuts and bolts of all the fictional series. Of course, if you have specific questions, fire away.

Quote:

Furthermore, does anybody have any checklists for any and all TF lines? Thanks guys you are being very helpful

I have an Excel file that has everything released Stateside up through either Classics or TF07 (can't remember where I stopped), but I'll have to look at it to make sure. There's also the Resources database over at TFW2005.com that has images, stats and reviews for the US releases. It also covers Japanese releases that differ significantly from their US counterparts (or just weren't available in the US).

Tarquinius · 11-16-2010, 06:51 PM

Here is another question for this......

I've been looking at reclaiming some of the Universe line, and I found some scout class figures.

I have to admit I'm a huge stickler to keeping everythin in scale with each other...Is the scout class for smaller figures in the mythos or are they just Characters in a smaller format?

Basically, are they "in scale" with the deluxe figures?

Optimus Scourge · 11-16-2010, 08:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tarquinius

Here is another question for this......

I've been looking at reclaiming some of the Universe line, and I found some scout class figures.

I have to admit I'm a huge stickler to keeping everythin in scale with each other...Is the scout class for smaller figures in the mythos or are they just Characters in a smaller format?

Basically, are they "in scale" with the deluxe figures?

Both, they are meant to be like the minibots in G1 even though we have a deluxe BB, I have the legends BB also Cosmos, wheelie, etc were minibots, Hot Rod is an extra we have a deluxe beachcomber was a minibot Hound is a deluxe but an added minibot to give some variety at low pricepoint

Tarquinius · 11-16-2010, 08:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Optimus Scourge

Both, they are meant to be like the minibots in G1 even though we have a deluxe BB, I have the legends BB also Cosmos, wheelie, etc were minibots, Hot Rod is an extra we have a deluxe beachcomber was a minibot Hound is a deluxe but an added minibot to give some variety at low pricepoint

So for example...The Three Warriors Pack at TRU....are they mini bots orrrr are they like regular toons shrinked?

Crazy Jetty · 11-16-2010, 11:24 PM

Scale? What's that?
Something no one's mentioned yet for you, is "class" like Scouts, are pricepoint sizes.

First are Minicons. None are sold anymore by themselves, but originally they were tiny, and in three-packs, and connected to large TFs.
Next up are Scout Class. They average $8.
Deluxe follows, at roughtly $12. (Generations so far is exclusively deluxe class line)
Voyager Class, is when TFs start being in boxes, and average $20.
Ultra Class (There are currently no ultras at retail), $30
Leader Class, $40
and Supreme Class, $50 (Typically. However, RotF Devestator was called Supreme, and was $100. Battle Opts Bumblebee is claimed to be a Supreme, and is $60)

Outside of the main line, are the Legends, and the Power Core Combiners.
Legends are the smallest, they average $5 usd. Think of them as pocket transformers. They're really sort of a sidesomething that's entirely all to themselves. They're roughly to TFs, what DCIH is to DCUC.

Powercore Combiners are a second sideline that Hasbro hasn't really given an official home to. They come in two pricepoints, and you'll find modern Minicons with them.

2-Packs, $10
5-Packs are $20.

Minibots are a fan term for a specific group of G1 transformers that were released in 84, 85, and 86. They were a group of small transformer toys called Minibots, and fans still use this term to carry over to the same characters (Such as Bumblebee, Cliffjumper, Brawn, Cosmos, Wheelie, Warpath, Powerglide, ect) for *any* release, no matter how big or small. So try not to let that confuse you.

And so, if you're trying to keep things in scale, good luck. There pretty much is no scale in TF.

Legends are generally not in scale with anything at all.

For scale, here's the closest thing:
Movie Universe Autobots:
RotF Leaderclass: Optimus Prime
Movie 1 Voyager: Ironhide, and Ratchet
Movie 1 Deluxe: Jazz
HftD Deluxe: Battle Blades Bumblebee
RotF Deluxe: Mudflap, Skids, Sideswipe, Jolt
RotF Legends: Arcee, Wheelie

It's not as accurate, but a second line up at a smaller and cheaper scale-
HftD Voyager: Battle Blades Prime
HftD Deluxe: Irohide, and Ratchet
RotF Legends: Bumblebee, Arcee, Mudflap, Skids, Jolt, Sideswipe.

The Decepticons have very little scale with each other, and NO scale with the autobots.

Hasbro is inconsistant with scale. Back in the day, we had motorcycles the same size as space shuttles.
Flash foreward to now, again they're still inconsistant. Blackout, who's one of the biggest characters in the movie, is actually shorter in stature (Dispite being a voyager) than Arcee (Who's a deluxe).
Then they also have stated that Generations will be exclusively Deluxe, which means that all characters, no matter how big or small they originally were, are equal.

Primacron · 11-17-2010, 06:41 AM

Here's my effort at quickly explaining the world of Transformers and my take on where to start!

This is a quick overview of the different continuities:

G1+G2 - The Generation 1 toyline is the blocky and fairly unposable figures/characters you probably remember from the 1980's. This is also the era that most people are nostalgic for. Generation 2 was more of the same, for the most part re-decos of G1, but with a few more modern figures creeping in towards the end.

Beast Wars/Machines - The Beast Era is where ball joints became standard so making everything much more posable. The series stands out as having the best fiction in terms of it's supporting cartoon, continuity wise it actually followed on from the G1 fiction. Some great molds as well.

Robots in Disguise (RID) - The first proper modern Transformers toyline, again some great figures but a different universe.

Armada/Energon/Cybertron (AEC) - These form the 'Unicron Trilogy'. This is where Hasbro/Takara really started to perfect the art of a transforming toy, much more detailed and generally better than anything that had come before. Many were homages to G1 (and so started the 'neo' G1 collecting). There were some really great figures in these lines including Unicron, and pretty much everything in Cybertron was good.

Movie-Verse (aka Bayformers) - Toys based on the live action films and supporting media, these don't appeal to everyone as they have a different look and feel to previous lines (hence 'Bayformers'). Over the last year these have become less movie like and it's a bit more ambiguous about where they fit in.

There have been a few other lines, mostly homaging G1 in some way, but mostly without any supporting fiction (although some of the Classics style figures have appeared in the IDW comics).

There was Alternators and Masterpiece (which are roughly in scale with each other), and are much larger and more detailed, aimed at collectors. They're pretty expensive now (alternators finished a few years back) but amazing. They're not far off being in scale with 3.75" figures.

There have also been a couple of 'Universe' lines, which initially was a line of repaints, but then turned into a follow up to Classics (which was a G1 homage line). Finally we come to 'Generations' which as previously has been said, is a follow up to Universe.

Given you're not that familiar with the history of it, I think you're in a great position because you're not going to worry about the 'G1 accuracy' that plagues some of us. Just see what you like the look of!

If you're after some fiction to link it all together then I'd recommend the 1986 cartoon movie - Bumblebee, Prime, Megatron, Soundwave, Cliffjumper, Thrust, Dirge and Blurr who we've got in Generations are in it, Grimlock's in the film as well, as are Jazz, Wreck-Gar, Scourge, Perceptor and Kup who are coming out soon (Wheeljack and Windcharger who are also on their way are also in the movie, but not at their best.........).

I believe there's a store exclusive coming out soon with Hot Rod and Cyclonus as well, which means you wouldn't be far off having the main cast - a few others were (including Galvatron) were released in Universe, and if you're feeling flush then there are good third party (unofficial) figures of Ultra Magnus and Springer. Enjoy!

Crazy Jetty · 11-17-2010, 10:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Primacron

There was Alternators and Masterpiece (which are roughly in scale with each other), and are much larger and more detailed, aimed at collectors. They're pretty expensive now (alternators finished a few years back) but amazing. They're not far off being in scale with 3.75" figures.

Actually, Masterpiece *isn't* in scale with Alternators, nor even itself.
Alternators are 1:24 scale. Optimus, I think is 1:18 scale. Megatron is 2:1 scale. Starscream is tiny (if he were 1:24, he'd be the size of a small coffee table). Grimlock also is smaller than 1:24, but not as badly as Starscream.
Grimlock should be huge and larger than Prime, but he's barily taller than an alternator. Starscream too, is way too small.

I think given his criteria of what he wants, I think movie or Generations are the best way to go. The movie autobots are the closest things in TF history (Outside of Beast Wars) to maintain a vague sense of scale with one another.
And Generations has a bunch of same sized key neo-G1 characters already available (In terms of Classics and Universe), and soon to be available. (Never mind that those are also the only two options he's allowed himself to have open)

trebleshot · 11-17-2010, 10:43 AM

Primacron, for shame! You completely skipped over Transformers Animated, one of the best in terms of fiction and engineering. In fact, in my opinion it was just as good as Beast Wars.

It is a self-contained continuity, but there are so many G1 references sprinkled throughout that it became a big hit with fans. Unfortunately, its "US Anime" style (think Cartoon Network's "Teen Titans" or "Scooby-Doo: Mystery Incorporated") was a very polarizing element with the fandom. Some loved it as a fresh take on the design, while others loathed it. Some even went so far as to say they were worse than "Bayformers".

The most impressive thing for me about Animated's toy line is how accurate the toys were to their show appearance, both in robot and alt modes, in spite of that odd aesthetic. Also, nearly every Animated toy had at least one appearance in the show.

The line and show ran from 2008-2009, though a few TRU exclusives were released this year. Aside from the exclusives, the toys are fairly easy to get still. Scale is not as much of an issue as most characters got multiple toys in different size classes so you can mix and match depending on your display needs.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tarquinius

So for example...The Three Warriors Pack at TRU....are they mini bots orrrr are they like regular toons shrinked?

Those are Scout-class toys originally from the Cybertron line. On the show, they were smaller characters (though Scattorshot got a sizable upgrade and new toy half-way through the series). So they would be in the proper scale compared to most other characters from Cybertron.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crazy Jetty

Outside of the main line, are the Legends, and the Power Core Combiners.
Legends are the smallest, they average $5 usd. Think of them as pocket transformers. They're really sort of a sidesomething that's entirely all to themselves. They're roughly to TFs, what DCIH is to DCUC.

Legends-class toys are considered part of a main line, and have been since their debut with Cybertron. They are just as much a part of a given mainline as the other size classes. However, their character selection generally leaves them out of scale with anything else in their line.

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Legends are generally not in scale with anything at all.

Some of them size well with other classes (like the Minibots and a few others), but larger characters like Prime and Megatron are definitely out-of-scale.

Basically, it's a mix-and-match process with Transformers since there is no single scale that everything adheres to, unlike other toy lines. Hasbro has been paying more attention to it in recent years, but some things just can't be done physically. Like making a Peterbilt long-nose truck and an F-22 Raptor that are in the same scale that aren't insanely huge and equally expensive.

It's practically a tradition now, given the genesis of the Transformers toy line itself.

Quote:

And so, if you're trying to keep things in scale, good luck. There pretty much is no scale in TF.

Agreed.

Crazy Jetty · 11-17-2010, 12:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trebleshot

Legends-class toys are considered part of a main line, and have been since their debut with Cybertron. They are just as much a part of a given mainline as the other size classes. However, their character selection generally leaves them out of scale with anything else in their line.

Some of them size well with other classes (like the Minibots and a few others), but larger characters like Prime and Megatron are definitely out-of-scale.

They're mainline in the same way that PCC is mainline, in that you can buy them anywhere and everywhere, and in that Hasbro likes to chuck them into gift sets that can be used to create some sense of scale (like "The Fury of Fearswoop)
And in that (Such as RotF legends Arcee with Leader Prime) there is some sense of scale. (In fact, I see PCC as a logical expansion of Legends. There's a really good scale between the two)
But the rest are rediculous when put with the mainline toys. Even the Minibots. Cosmos, Warpath, Beachcomber, Brawn... all those guys look rediculous lined up on my classics shelf.
But they look great with other legends.
Legends was never created to *be* mainline. They were a cheap alternative to the large toys, that could be put in discount stores and pharmacies. They were ment to be impulse buys, and originally weren't available anywhere else but those places, until TRU started to sell them.
They were part of Hasbro's (continuing) campaign of making prominant TF characters available in multiple size classes so that even kids with limited funds could have their favorite character.
Legends of Cybertron was successful, and eventually Hasbro expanded it, dropped the "of cybertron" and adapted it for the movie. There, if followed the exact same purpose as it did for Cybertron. Only when it was for Cybertron, no one would critisize anyone for saying "Legends Scourge doesn't fit with Scout Scattorshot," like they will critisize you for saying the same thing about legends Trypticon.
It was only when Hasbro started making G1 homages is when people started trying to shoehorn it and claiming it's as much mainline as the deluxe.
Plain and simple, Legends are a sideline that's ment to make prominant characters available in a cheap, impulse buy pricepoint.

I *would* like to see a full line that utilizes legends, though. Small vehicles like Cars relegated to Legends, while large vehicles are appropriate to large sizes.
But then, I'm sort of opposite to Hasbro, who likes to place a big focus on big eensive toys. I however would love to see a return to how BW did it, and focused primarily on Basics and Deluxes, with leader characetrs reserved to Mega/voyager, and only giant characters recieving ultra and leader. And with Voyager, Ultra, and Leader class getting only a few toys each year (instead of half the line).

Primacron · 11-17-2010, 03:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trebleshot

Primacron, for shame! You completely skipped over Transformers Animated, one of the best in terms of fiction and engineering. In fact, in my opinion it was just as good as Beast Wars.

Yeah, uh, that's what I meant by 'a few other lines mostly homaging G1 in some way'..........

I agree with the comments about scale - it doesn't really work, I think you just have to go with what looks good rather than strictly obeying scale.

trebleshot · 11-17-2010, 09:05 PM

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Originally Posted by Crazy Jetty

They're mainline in the same way that PCC is mainline, in that you can buy them anywhere and everywhere, and in that Hasbro likes to chuck them into gift sets that can be used to create some sense of scale (like "The Fury of Fearswoop)

Ah, I think I understand your point, but I believe we are having parallel conversations. I feel that the Legends class is part of the same mainline because they share the same packaging as the larger size classes with no additional labels to designate them as a separate line (or even subline). Granted, some characters look ridiculous when their Legends version is next to other size classes.

But there's no label on them designating them as a separate line, aside from the possible exception of Cybertron since it had the title "Legends of Cybertron". But the ones released for the movies, Universe 2.0, and now HFTD all share the same packaging as the deluxe, voyager, leader and even supreme releases of those lines.

Compare that to Gravity Bots, Fast Action Battlers and RPMs. Forgoing the obvious transformation and gimmick differences, each one has distinct packaging traits that separate them from ROTF, even though the same characters appear in each line.

To me, you seem to be looking at it more from a scale and character perspective, whereas I'm looking at it more from a toy line perspective, regardless of the characters.

For example, let's look at ROTF. Based on your criteria, would Leader Starscream count as mainline? He's much closer to scale with the others than his voyager counterpart (and certainly better than his legends version). But where does that leave voyager Starscream, then? He doesn't fit well with most of his size class and actually seems a better fit standing with the Legends.

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Even the Minibots. Cosmos, Warpath, Beachcomber, Brawn... all those guys look rediculous lined up on my classics shelf.
But they look great with other legends.

Personally, I think the Minibot Legends look great next to other Classics, since that is about the same scale as the G1 toys were and for the most part, backed by the cartoon. The Minibots were TINY compared to most of their fellow Autobots.

Granted, the G1 cartoon played fast and loose with scale all the time, but Bumblebee was always one of the smallest and frankly I think the Classics version of him is not in scale with Classic Prime. But I have them both on the Classics shelf because they're from the same line. I also have Universe 2.0 figures (including Legends) on the same shelves because I consider that line to be a continuation of Classics (same as I do with Generations and most of Reveal the Shield when it comes out).

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Legends was never created to *be* mainline. They were a cheap alternative to the large toys, that could be put in discount stores and pharmacies. They were ment to be impulse buys, and originally weren't available anywhere else but those places, until TRU started to sell them.
They were part of Hasbro's (continuing) campaign of making prominant TF characters available in multiple size classes so that even kids with limited funds could have their favorite character.
Legends of Cybertron was successful, and eventually Hasbro expanded it, dropped the "of cybertron" and adapted it for the movie. There, if followed the exact same purpose as it did for Cybertron. Only when it was for Cybertron, no one would critisize anyone for saying "Legends Scourge doesn't fit with Scout Scattorshot," like they will critisize you for saying the same thing about legends Trypticon.
It was only when Hasbro started making G1 homages is when people started trying to shoehorn it and claiming it's as much mainline as the deluxe.

True, LoC was originally intended to be a "Hall of Fame" type subline similar to Heroes of Cybertron, only transformable. But in my mind, the Legends class is as much a part of the mainline now as the Scout, Deluxe, Voyager and Leader classes are.

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I *would* like to see a full line that utilizes legends, though. Small vehicles like Cars relegated to Legends, while large vehicles are appropriate to large sizes.

As I said, I think the Minibots, at least, are a step in the right direction. But as we both know, Hasbro doesn't use the size classes strictly as benchmarks of scale. And I don't see them changing it any time soon.

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Originally Posted by Primacron

Yeah, uh, that's what I meant by 'a few other lines mostly homaging G1 in some way'..........

Well, technically you could say that about every TF line since G1. But I feel that TFA should have been mentioned in the same breath as Beast Wars or RiD. Like those, the toy line was also backed by strong fiction: a three-season cartoon that aired on Cartoon Network and a published comic book.

I could go on and on about TFA, but I'll just say this: it was definitely not a G1 retread. Sure, it had a ton of homages, cameos and inside jokes, but it did a lot of new and unique things too. I would definitely recommend it as highly as I would Beast Wars or RiD as one the best examples of TF fiction out there.

Tarquinius · 11-17-2010, 09:36 PM

Thank you everybody for their wonderful and informative responses. I think you all truly understand where I'm coming from and thusly all of your advice is very sound.

As a collector I tend to try and complete most of the lines I collect, but I've totally given up on that for Transformers...and I tend to collect only what looks cool like everyone has said.

Heres another question I suppose....

much like Iron Man 2 and Wolverine Origins having characters which supplement the Marvel Universe line...are there any characters like that in the movie lines that came out? I've completely ignored them because I wasnt a big fan of the movie renditions of some of the characters but maybe there are a few that are exclusive to this line?

Crazy Jetty · 11-17-2010, 09:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tarquinius

Thank you everybody for their wonderful and informative responses. I think you all truly understand where I'm coming from and thusly all of your advice is very sound.

As a collector I tend to try and complete most of the lines I collect, but I've totally given up on that for Transformers...and I tend to collect only what looks cool like everyone has said.

Heres another question I suppose....

much like Iron Man 2 and Wolverine Origins having characters which supplement the Marvel Universe line...are there any characters like that in the movie lines that came out? I've completely ignored them because I wasnt a big fan of the movie renditions of some of the characters but maybe there are a few that are exclusive to this line?

Well, if I understand your question, then... sorta.
The Movie is so specific with the style, and that bleeds through to the *entire* Movie 1 and RotF lines, with a few exceptions.
In the first movie, Hasbro released some repaints of toys that were ment to be in the then upcoming Universe line. Two notable examples were Decepticons Crankcase and Fracture. They were ment to supplement Universe, but Walmart requested more movie and were then shunted there.
So, they're not in the same style as the movie toys.

In the current movie line, with the Scout class, and with the toys released in the Hunt for the Decepticon subline and beyond, Hasbro has started to blurr the styles with "Off Screen Characters." (Hasbro *always* supplements whatever mainline with toys of characters that aren't in the cartoon/movie)
They have a style that blends the asthetic qualities of the movie, with more traditional "G1" asthetics of all the lines before it.
The purpose, I suppose is like slipping comicbook Gambit into Wolverine Movie.
We've gotten several of what could be considered Supplements to Universe/Generations this way. Bludgeon, Bonzaitron, Seaspray, Mindset to name a few off the top of my head, with several more coming.

Crazy Jetty · 11-17-2010, 10:04 PM

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Originally Posted by trebleshot

Personally, I think the Minibot Legends look great next to other Classics, since that is about the same scale as the G1 toys were and for the most part, backed by the cartoon. The Minibots were TINY compared to most of their fellow Autobots.

Now see, this is what I feel the Scout/Basics are for. Minibots would look GREAT in this size. 'Bee, Wheelie, Cosmos would be perfect.
The few minibots that have been in this class are equally perfect. Huffer (Both Botcon and PCC), Armorhide standing in for Pipes, RotF Beachcomber, Fallback. To me, legends is no substitutes.

Doesn't stop me from getting them. They're great fiddle toys. It's fun to put them with guys they might be in scale with (Trypticon, Metroplex, E-Combiners)
But I could never put Legends Trypticon or Trailcutter in my display and say it's good.
I have to have scouts surrounding Cosmos and Wheelie, separating them from the deluxes and larger, so they don't look too out of place.
But, we'll just have to agree to disagree on this one. I see your points, and see where you're coming from, and I can tell that you genuinely get what I'm saying, too.

Primacron · 11-18-2010, 01:56 AM

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Originally Posted by trebleshot

Well, technically you could say that about every TF line since G1. But I feel that TFA should have been mentioned in the same breath as Beast Wars or RiD. Like those, the toy line was also backed by strong fiction: a three-season cartoon that aired on Cartoon Network and a published comic book.

I could go on and on about TFA, but I'll just say this: it was definitely not a G1 retread. Sure, it had a ton of homages, cameos and inside jokes, but it did a lot of new and unique things too. I would definitely recommend it as highly as I would Beast Wars or RiD as one the best examples of TF fiction out there.

I think you missed the embarrassment icon!

Yeah, I realise I missed out Animated. I've nothing against it, I'm very happy with my animated Dinobots.

I would have liked the Universe minibots to have all been scouts rather than legends, but since they started making them legends class I'd like them all to be legends class. The upcoming Generations Windcharger looks good though.

trebleshot · 11-18-2010, 07:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tarquinius

much like Iron Man 2 and Wolverine Origins having characters which supplement the Marvel Universe line...are there any characters like that in the movie lines that came out? I've completely ignored them because I wasnt a big fan of the movie renditions of some of the characters but maybe there are a few that are exclusive to this line?

Yes and no. Crazy Jetty made some valid points about how the lines are blurring when it comes to Movie and non-Movie toys. This is compounded by Hasbro's use of older molds being redeco'd and included in current lines as different characters (Crankcase, Fracture, Big Daddy and Grindcore are good examples).

If we went strictly on toy lines, then some of Universe 2.0 could fill in for Movie and vice-versa. Some of HFTD could go in the Movie group while others from HTFD could go in the Classics/Universe 2.0/Generations group ("Neo G1").

Transformers really doesn't have a straight-on comparison to MU when it comes to supplemental lines like IM2 and XMO:W, though I guess HFTD would technically be the companion line to ROTF and Reveal The Shield is set to become the MU equivalent of Transformers (at least until TF3 comes out).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crazy Jetty

Now see, this is what I feel the Scout/Basics are for. Minibots would look GREAT in this size. 'Bee, Wheelie, Cosmos would be perfect.
The few minibots that have been in this class are equally perfect. Huffer (Both Botcon and PCC), Armorhide standing in for Pipes, RotF Beachcomber, Fallback. To me, legends is no substitutes.

I definitely agree the Scout class would have worked as well. But I also think Legends have their place, especially when you look at the Supreme class.

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Doesn't stop me from getting them. They're great fiddle toys. It's fun to put them with guys they might be in scale with (Trypticon, Metroplex, E-Combiners)
But I could never put Legends Trypticon or Trailcutter in my display and say it's good.
I have to have scouts surrounding Cosmos and Wheelie, separating them from the deluxes and larger, so they don't look too out of place.

Oh, yeah, definitely. In no way would I consider Legends Trypticon and Trailcutter as the Classics versions of those characters. I even consider them to be separate characters in my own TF multiverse. But I still call Trypticon a Universe 2.0 toy and Trailcutter will be a Reveal The Shield toy when he comes out.

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But, we'll just have to agree to disagree on this one. I see your points, and see where you're coming from, and I can tell that you genuinely get what I'm saying, too.

Agreed.

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Originally Posted by Primacron

I think you missed the embarrassment icon!

Yeah, I realise I missed out Animated. I've nothing against it, I'm very happy with my animated Dinobots.

I think I missed it too. Or misunderstood it, at least. C'est la vie.

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I would have liked the Universe minibots to have all been scouts rather than legends, but since they started making them legends class I'd like them all to be legends class. The upcoming Generations Windcharger looks good though.

Yeah, all the Minibots as Scouts would be cool and it might still happen considering RTS Windcharger. Besides, we all know Hasbro loves to make Bumblebee toys

But I also hope Hasbro finishes the Minibots off in Legends class as well. Only nine more to go, Hasbro!*

*The total includes redoing Powerglide and Seaspray, who already have up-scaled releases who have alt molds that are closer in scale to their real-word counterparts but are way off when looking at the scale for robot mode.

10-21-2010, 07:02 AM	#6
trebleshot Dark Lord of the 'Ark Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Ohio Posts: 8,224	Quote: Originally Posted by Tarquinius ROTF Movie line is basically self contained within the movie and features "movie figures" Yes, to a point. It is self-contained in that it has movie toys and off-screen "movie" characters, but nothing that strayed too far outside that universe and design aesthetic. The last wave or so began to show the direction that HTFD would go, with more blended aesthetics that blurred the line between movie and non-movie styling. Quote: Generations is a continuation of a previous line called Classics which then evolved into Universe 2.0 (So it goes classics-universe 2.0-generations) Exactly correct. Generations is also a little broader than its predecessors since it not only has "classic"-style designs, it also has other niche stuff like toys based on the War For Cybertron video games. And technically, Power Core Combiners is its own separate subline and not part of Generations. It's in the same red packaging, but does not bear the "Generations" tag under the TF logo. It has a PCC logo instead. Quote: Hunt for Deceptacons goes either way, it just being its own line which has movie esque figures but may have one or two random ones thrown in there which would supplement the Classic/Generation theme. Also correct. HFTD is to Revenge of the Fallen as Pursuit of Cobra was to Rise of Cobra. Basically it's a transitional line that contains the movie stuff with a few toys that could easily display with Classics or Movie toys. Eventually it will become RTS, which will lead into The Dark of the Moon toy line (aka TF3). As for what to look for, nostalgia plays a big factor for most TF collectors. But on toy merits alone, here are a few to check out for each line. Keep in mind, all of these suggestions are based on toys I actually own: Generations: Get pretty much everything in this line. Probably one of the best lines Hasbro has done in years and it continues the excellent work done for Classics and Universe 2.0. To give you an idea, Generations Thrust is a remold/redeco of Classics Starscream (one of many remold/repaints out there) and Generations Red Alert is a remold/redeco of Universe 2.0 Sideswipe (which is also used to make Sunstreaker, but with a clever twist on reusing the mold. Sunstreaker came first, btw). Also, the WFC toys are great, especially Soundwave and Prime (haven't found Megs yet). Power Core Combiners: Some of these are hit-or-miss for me. Nothing horrible, but some aren't that special. So far my favorites are Bombshock (although watch the Jeep leg; connector point is a little loose), Leadfoot, Icepick and Smolder. Definitely get Leadfoot, if only for Pinpointer. Pinpointer is arguably the best Minicon ever made. Revenge Of The Fallen: The entire scout class. Every one ranges from good to awesome. There are some redecos (a couple molds have 3 different paint schemes), but at the very least try to pick up one of each mold. As for the larger classes, I'd recommend Autobot Skids and Mudflap, Brawn, Jetfire, Optimus Prime (Leader and Voyager), Recon Ironhide, Bludgeon, Lockdown, and Mindwipe. Leader-class Prime and Jetfire have a combined mode that is just massive and rivals Brave Series combiners for sheer bulk, plus it still has decent articulation! Hunt For The Decepticons: The entire scout class again. Continued from ROTF, but new molds mixed in with the redecos. Other good picks include Legends Devastator (TRU Exclusive), Legends Ravage, Sea Spray, Ironhide, and Hailstorm. Like nakobass said, there's even more goodness on the horizon for all three (four) lines. And definitely look into the older Classics/Universe 2.0 lines. There were some real gems in those two lines as well. __________________ Last edited by trebleshot; 10-21-2010 at 07:10 AM..

10-21-2010, 10:13 AM	#9
Shin Densetsu OPTIMUS GUINNESS Join Date: Oct 2008 Posts: 8,542	Basically, the ROTF line featured some designs which were IIRC, meant for Classics 2.0 in 2008 but did not make it until ROTF, like Bludgeon. By the same token, Seaspray from HFTD IMHO, fits more in Classics than movie. HFTD is primarily movie styling. Generations is primarily Classics styling. Both lines are merging into Reveal the Shield. Power Core Combiners is its own line. The Universe exclusive repaints(like Countdown and Bruticus) at TRU are seen as "close enough" by Hasbro to fit in with Universe/Classics 2.0. Armada was a step back in articulation and was a gimmick line. So were Energon and Cybertron, but Cybertron was known for the return to full articulation for most figures, and some fans who despised Armada/Energon like Cybertron, like me. I loved Cybertron. Cybertron Prime is one of the BEST modern Prime figures ever made. __________________ The Transformers! Knowing Is Half The Battle! Thunder, Thunder, Hoooooooo!!!!! Tokusatsu all day everyday! CHECK OUT OUR RESOURCES SECTIONS HERE!: Transformers Database GI Joe Database

10-21-2010, 12:57 PM	#10
trebleshot Dark Lord of the 'Ark Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Ohio Posts: 8,224	Quote: Originally Posted by Tarquinius Few more questions Went to TRU today and saw Grimlock which was TF Masterpiece? Where and how does this fit? Seems like a traditional character so I would want to say Generations/Classics/Universe. Hasbro put him in the Generations line for the US release, but firmpulse is correct: he really belongs in the Masterpiece line (he was released in Japan first, with different accessories, paint apps, etc). I would have recommended it above, but I don't have him yet. He's on my must-buy list for certain. Plus, being a T-Rex, he actually does scale rather well with Classics toys from pics I've seen. Quote: I also saw the TRU Exclusive Universe Figures...and those ARE from the Universe line which leads into the Generations etc? Its not just pure coincidence that they have the same name? Well, like Shin said, those are supposed to be part of Universe 2.0 (hence the packaging), but they're really redecos from previous lines that are "close enough" to fit in with the overall aesthetic of Classics/Universe 2.0. Oh, and TRU Darkwind is a redeco of Universe 2.0 Silverbolt (simplistic mold, but a lot of fun and character). There are also some Walmart exclusives done the same way (but they only use Universe 2.0 molds). Most of the exclusives are homages to G1 characters. Actually, sometimes the exclusives can drive you batty if you're a completist or even a mold completist like me. Quote: And Pirahanacon off of BBTS...whats up with that? Again I have no idea about the mythos here but I know G1 was like...the first series/toyline? So its just a re-release of that? Pirahnacon is a G1 reissue. And yes, G1 was the original TF toy line that ran from 1984-1990 in the US (through '92 in Europe and other countries). Also known as the Seacons, they were one of the last combiner teams released in G1 and arguably one of the best. All of the smaller ones are interchangeable in combined mode (each one can be an arm or a leg). And each one of those has the ability to transform from robot to creature to limb to hand-held weapon for the combined mode! Definitely a good start if you want to jump down the G1 rabbit hole Quote: Core-Combiners, are these in scale with anything else? I don't think so butcan someone help me here As I said, PCC is a separate line, so it's not in-scale with anything else. What it does have is the sheer amount of customization you can do with the combination gimmick. Any commander figure can be used with any combination of the drones. Plus the Minicon use a standard size peg/hole system making all the Minicons compatible too (even with older lines like Armada, Energon and Cybertron). Quote: And as far as older lines, (MegaPrime). I might be interested in checkign some of this stuff out, but I might need some more background information about the progression of the Transformers mythos as well as the toyline. How would you say the articulation, paint apps are for some of those lines? Always seemed to me that older transformers had minimal articulation In general, G1 had the least amount of articulation (some only a couple of points total). As the brand got older, more articulation was added. Then Armada came and the gimmicks in that line practically killed or maimed any articulation the molds had. But since then, articulation has come back in a big way. That's not to say there weren't a few awesome G1 toys back then that are still good now. Soundwave is a good example of this and probably the best mold in the first 2 waves of G1. Paint apps have been relatively sparse through the years (G1 had stickers for its details), but for what they've had, it was good quality. Fiction-wise, the TF Wiki and Wikipedia would give you the nuts and bolts of all the fictional series. Of course, if you have specific questions, fire away. Quote: Furthermore, does anybody have any checklists for any and all TF lines? Thanks guys you are being very helpful I have an Excel file that has everything released Stateside up through either Classics or TF07 (can't remember where I stopped), but I'll have to look at it to make sure. There's also the Resources database over at TFW2005.com that has images, stats and reviews for the US releases. It also covers Japanese releases that differ significantly from their US counterparts (or just weren't available in the US). __________________ Last edited by trebleshot; 10-21-2010 at 01:05 PM..

11-16-2010, 11:24 PM	#14
Crazy Jetty WINGNUT & SCREWLOOSE! Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Dallas Posts: 2,172	Scale? What's that? Something no one's mentioned yet for you, is "class" like Scouts, are pricepoint sizes. First are Minicons. None are sold anymore by themselves, but originally they were tiny, and in three-packs, and connected to large TFs. Next up are Scout Class. They average $8. Deluxe follows, at roughtly $12. (Generations so far is exclusively deluxe class line) Voyager Class, is when TFs start being in boxes, and average $20. Ultra Class (There are currently no ultras at retail), $30 Leader Class, $40 and Supreme Class, $50 (Typically. However, RotF Devestator was called Supreme, and was $100. Battle Opts Bumblebee is claimed to be a Supreme, and is $60) Outside of the main line, are the Legends, and the Power Core Combiners. Legends are the smallest, they average $5 usd. Think of them as pocket transformers. They're really sort of a sidesomething that's entirely all to themselves. They're roughly to TFs, what DCIH is to DCUC. Powercore Combiners are a second sideline that Hasbro hasn't really given an official home to. They come in two pricepoints, and you'll find modern Minicons with them. 2-Packs, $10 5-Packs are $20. Minibots are a fan term for a specific group of G1 transformers that were released in 84, 85, and 86. They were a group of small transformer toys called Minibots, and fans still use this term to carry over to the same characters (Such as Bumblebee, Cliffjumper, Brawn, Cosmos, Wheelie, Warpath, Powerglide, ect) for any release, no matter how big or small. So try not to let that confuse you. And so, if you're trying to keep things in scale, good luck. There pretty much is no scale in TF. Legends are generally not in scale with anything at all. For scale, here's the closest thing: Movie Universe Autobots: RotF Leaderclass: Optimus Prime Movie 1 Voyager: Ironhide, and Ratchet Movie 1 Deluxe: Jazz HftD Deluxe: Battle Blades Bumblebee RotF Deluxe: Mudflap, Skids, Sideswipe, Jolt RotF Legends: Arcee, Wheelie It's not as accurate, but a second line up at a smaller and cheaper scale- HftD Voyager: Battle Blades Prime HftD Deluxe: Irohide, and Ratchet RotF Legends: Bumblebee, Arcee, Mudflap, Skids, Jolt, Sideswipe. The Decepticons have very little scale with each other, and NO scale with the autobots. Hasbro is inconsistant with scale. Back in the day, we had motorcycles the same size as space shuttles. Flash foreward to now, again they're still inconsistant. Blackout, who's one of the biggest characters in the movie, is actually shorter in stature (Dispite being a voyager) than Arcee (Who's a deluxe). Then they also have stated that Generations will be exclusively Deluxe, which means that all characters, no matter how big or small they originally were, are equal. Last edited by Crazy Jetty; 11-16-2010 at 11:34 PM..

11-17-2010, 10:43 AM	#17
trebleshot Dark Lord of the 'Ark Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Ohio Posts: 8,224	Primacron, for shame! You completely skipped over Transformers Animated, one of the best in terms of fiction and engineering. In fact, in my opinion it was just as good as Beast Wars. It is a self-contained continuity, but there are so many G1 references sprinkled throughout that it became a big hit with fans. Unfortunately, its "US Anime" style (think Cartoon Network's "Teen Titans" or "Scooby-Doo: Mystery Incorporated") was a very polarizing element with the fandom. Some loved it as a fresh take on the design, while others loathed it. Some even went so far as to say they were worse than "Bayformers". The most impressive thing for me about Animated's toy line is how accurate the toys were to their show appearance, both in robot and alt modes, in spite of that odd aesthetic. Also, nearly every Animated toy had at least one appearance in the show. The line and show ran from 2008-2009, though a few TRU exclusives were released this year. Aside from the exclusives, the toys are fairly easy to get still. Scale is not as much of an issue as most characters got multiple toys in different size classes so you can mix and match depending on your display needs. Quote: Originally Posted by Tarquinius So for example...The Three Warriors Pack at TRU....are they mini bots orrrr are they like regular toons shrinked? Those are Scout-class toys originally from the Cybertron line. On the show, they were smaller characters (though Scattorshot got a sizable upgrade and new toy half-way through the series). So they would be in the proper scale compared to most other characters from Cybertron. Quote: Originally Posted by Crazy Jetty Outside of the main line, are the Legends, and the Power Core Combiners. Legends are the smallest, they average $5 usd. Think of them as pocket transformers. They're really sort of a sidesomething that's entirely all to themselves. They're roughly to TFs, what DCIH is to DCUC. Legends-class toys are considered part of a main line, and have been since their debut with Cybertron. They are just as much a part of a given mainline as the other size classes. However, their character selection generally leaves them out of scale with anything else in their line. Quote: Legends are generally not in scale with anything at all. Some of them size well with other classes (like the Minibots and a few others), but larger characters like Prime and Megatron are definitely out-of-scale. Basically, it's a mix-and-match process with Transformers since there is no single scale that everything adheres to, unlike other toy lines. Hasbro has been paying more attention to it in recent years, but some things just can't be done physically. Like making a Peterbilt long-nose truck and an F-22 Raptor that are in the same scale that aren't insanely huge and equally expensive. It's practically a tradition now, given the genesis of the Transformers toy line itself. Quote: And so, if you're trying to keep things in scale, good luck. There pretty much is no scale in TF. Agreed. __________________ Last edited by trebleshot; 11-18-2010 at 07:01 AM..