[psyfy]

Any ideas how this could all go down?

[En Sabah Nerd]

Ummm, he's mentally not all there so he'd maybe accidentally kill everyone or never use it because he has the mind of a handicapped child who drowned.

[CMIII]

the only intelligent thing Jason does is find ways to kill people.

[jestermon]

Yeah unless it made him smart he would just use it to strangle people with it.

[TheBlueMarvel]

Nebula was a mindless zombie when she gained control of the gauntlet. She accessed it while Thanos had elevated himself to a greater plane of consciousness. The circumstances of her acquisition was not one born of guile or intellect. Instead, Nebula came into possession the gauntlet via good fortune or possibly providence. I suppose the same could happen for Jason (*snicker*). However, while Nebula was reverted to her natural (more capable) form, Jason would still be an idiot were he to gain the gauntlet....albeit an idiot with the powers of Eternity.

[En Sabah Nerd]

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheBlueMarvel

Nebula was a mindless zombie when she gained control of the gauntlet. She accessed it while Thanos had elevated himself to a greater plane of consciousness. The circumstances of her acquisition was not one born of guile or intellect. Instead, Nebula came into possession the gauntlet via good fortune or possibly providence. I suppose the same could happen for Jason (*snicker*). However, while Nebula was reverted to her natural (more capable) form, Jason would still be an idiot were he to gain the gauntlet....albeit an idiot with the powers of Eternity.

She wasn't mindless, just incapable of conveying thought (speech, motion, etc.) but her brain was still working, it's not like the gauntlet chose to jump onto her hand or anything.

[kylactus]

He would resurrect his mother, warp time so as to avoid his tragic death, thus sparing all the needless bloodshed, regularly attend special education classes, eventually (and ironically) leading to duel degrees in criminal justice and anger counseling. He then climbs the rungs of our judicial system until finally becoming the first mentally challenged supreme court justice in the united states. The first case he hears is "Tommy Jarvis v.s. General Latex corp." on the grounds of damages caused by an inferior flammable mask rubber that lead to Mr. Jarvis being (in a twist of unforeseen irony) hideously disfigured and becoming a rage filled serial killer who covers his twisted form with... get this, A HOCKEY MASK!!!!!. Justice Voorhees awards Mr. Jarvis's victims an unprecedented one trillion-quagillion dollars and unlimited passes for pony rides... he is after all mentally challenged.

Note: the award will likely be negotiated into a more realistic number by appellant court judges.

[redx24]

Quote:

Originally Posted by kylactus

He would resurrect his mother, warp time so as to avoid his tragic death, thus sparing all the needless bloodshed, regularly attend special education classes, eventually (and ironically) leading to duel degrees in criminal justice and anger counseling. He then climbs the rungs of our judicial system until finally becoming the first mentally challenged supreme court justice in the united states. The first case he hears is "Tommy Jarvis v.s. General Latex corp." on the grounds of damages caused by an inferior flammable mask rubber that lead to Mr. Jarvis being (in a twist of unforeseen irony) hideously disfigured and becoming a rage filled serial killer who covers his twisted form with... get this, A HOCKEY MASK!!!!!. Justice Voorhees awards Mr. Jarvis's victims an unprecedented one trillion-quagillion dollars and unlimited passes for pony rides... he is after all mentally challenged.

Note: the award will likely be negotiated into a more realistic number by appellant court judges.

Get the guys that made sharknado on this stat!

[TheBlueMarvel]

Quote:

Originally Posted by En Sabah Nerd

She wasn't mindless, just incapable of conveying thought (speech, motion, etc.) but her brain was still working, it's not like the gauntlet chose to jump onto her hand or anything.

Semantics. She was shambling around just like a zombie. Her state of being was an exact replication of the way popular culture has come to represent the aimless meandering of undead. When she grabs the gauntlet, her action is more instinctual (based on primal urges/base emotions) than it is premeditated. Similar to a zombie extending an outstretched hand, moaning, and shuffling after you with no real cognition. Before seizing the gauntlet, she actually stands there staring at it for multiple panels in a stupor doing nothing. In fact, at multiple points during the anarchy and bedlam of Thanos' reign, she's pictured staring off into space oblivious to what's going on around her. If you want to confer deliberative thought to any being in the shape she was in....then more power to you.

[En Sabah Nerd]

The panel states that a vengeance stirs in Nebula and she deliberately removes it from his hand, hell she kinda smiles when she realizes the opportunity, this wasn't random shambling "oh the glove just kinda ends up on my hand" it was "rrgh, I hate you and you're no longer physical so with the element of surprise I can take this."

[TheBlueMarvel]

Quote:

Originally Posted by En Sabah Nerd

The panel states that a vengeance stirs in Nebula and she deliberately removes it from his hand, hell she kinda smiles when she realizes the opportunity, this wasn't random shambling "oh the glove just kinda ends up on my hand" it was "rrgh, I hate you and you're no longer physical so with the element of surprise I can take this."

At this point, it becomes an argument of of whether emotions are considered cognition. I can tell you that people have beaten murder raps for doing things solely based on their emotions (not premeditated, but instinctual). The act is determined to have been committed on instinct rather than through deliberation (not unlike the device used with Nebula in this story) and sometimes the resulting instinctual action can involve a succession of movements. For example: the human instinct of 'fight or flight' is a biological response to fear(an emotion); you don't have to think about being afraid for your adrenaline to kick in. The panels you refer to detail that there is a 'stirring' 'deep inside' for vengeance. I can't speak for you, but that sounds more primal to me. The nuance between your 'just incapable of conveying thought (speech, motion, etc.) but her brain was still working' and my 'mindless zombie' is different only by degrees...Jim Starlin's definitive intention could only be sussed out with an interview...until that happens, it's open to interpretation. If you don't want her to be a zombie, then she doesn't have to be one. To me, she was a mindless zombie.

[En Sabah Nerd]

Thanos calls nebula "nearly mindless" and that she can't find peace in "unconsciousness or true death" which is kind of up in the air on the whole consciousness thing. It's like a person who's been lobotomized, technically as a standard observer we can't really know if they're still thinking, but they definitely can't convey much (although in theory we could monitor brain activity to see, but I'm pretty sure lobotomies are illegal now). My big "ah, that was thinking" is that she waits for him to no longer be physical and deliberately places the gauntlet on her hand. Any action of that degree spurred from emotional rashness or planned thought requires a functioning mind. Just like the standard fight or flight scenario, if you can't think enough to discern what may/not be danger then you'll feel no fear (like a koala bear, seriously these things are barely cognitive). So while I will stick to "thinking and feeling but unable to act until spurred" you should at least bump from "mindless zombie" to "nearly mindless with basest level of thought."

[TheBlueMarvel]

@En Sabah Nerd:

A couple of points of info….lobotomies are still legally performed. Prefrontal lobotomies are rare, but they can represent a last resort solution for some neurological conditions. With that said, lobotomies are generally frowned upon by neurologists. The popular notion that you are laboring under, which defines lobotomy patients as severely limited, is not entirely accurate. While movie depictions of lobotomized patients feature them as veritable vegetables, the reality of the situation represents a much wider range of functionality. Check out the book ‘My lobotomy’, it’s pretty fascinating. The subject of the book was an American bus driver who had a lobotomy when he was younger (audio of his personal account-in his own words- is on the web - 'My Lobotomy': Howard Dully's Journey : NPR- yes, I listen to NPR). Sometimes we forget that the Science in sci-fi is usually pedestrian and light on the actual science tip…you will find that Mr. Dully is pretty lucid, which is a contradiction to what people generally believe about lobotomized individuals.

Without specific insights into Starlin’s mind, your statement about Nebula “standing there and waiting” in some sort of deliberate fashion is little more than conjecture. From the perspective of the story, she was ambling about in near proximity to Thanos for the majority of her time in that form. To define her as doing so with a plan to seize upon the very moment that Thanos exits his corporeal form (there’s no way to predict this action even with full faculties of the mind) is a theoretical overreach and ignores the vast majority of her time spent acting like a mindless zombie.

Regarding what it takes in the way of cognition to carry out grabbing a glove and putting it on, I disagree. Procedural memory (memory for: motor skills, operant, and classic conditioning) is how we do things like ride a bike, walk, run, and jump. These things take place outside of our awareness. We don’t think about these things (normally – well this is the case for those of us that are reasonably athletic, coordinated, or generally older than 5yrs). This is good because it allows our minds to conduct other more important functions. While these actions aren’t as habituated as autonomic functions like breathing, they are pretty damn close. Your understanding of “fight or flight” is not how the phenomenon actually works. If we as humans had to think about running or jumping away from danger, or spend time analyzing threats rather than responding to instinct…well, most of us (as in almost all of us) would not be here right now. By that logic, as a species, we wouldn’t have made it out of the prehistoric era.

I was aware of Thanos’ description of Nebula from the very start, and thought (hoped) you’d bring it up sooner. The descriptor of “near mindless” is the reason I responded to you with “semantics” and it only serves to buttress my point of such. Since we are truthfully talking about take-away interpretations of this story, my opinion is that Thanos left Nebula with only enough sentience to suffer/chafe within her new state of being. Just enough presence of mind to know that she was fucked up lol! The sadist in me loves Thanos for exactly these sorts of moments! The difference between “nearly mindless” and “mindless zombie” is one of minutiae…nominal...insignificant…wait for it…semantic. Is he “chubby” or “nearly fat?” Is she “broke” or “nearly destitute? “ Different statements? Only by degrees. Nebula can be whatever you want her to be, man. For me: If it looks like a “mindless zombie”, walks like a “mindless zombie”, and talks like a “mindless zombie”….then it must be Nebula transformed by Thanos into a mindless zombie!

Sorry for long diatribe, but we entered into the realm of ridiculous superhero/comic forum debate a long time ago...and what's you beef with koalas? I rather like them...

[En Sabah Nerd]

Well Nebula can't be necessarily whatever I want, she'll never be a pirate microwave oven with nuclear rocket pods and a chipmunk for a pilot! Okay I'll quit here with the zombie/barely-there Nebula stuff and just agree that every one gets an opinion on any matter. I don't have a beef with koalas, but these guys are dumb. They have the smallest brain proportional to their body of any mammal and to make it worse they also have one of the smoothest brains in the animal kingdom. They've adapted to eat a leaf that is technically poisonous and very hard to chew, and due to their unknowing ways can't eat anything else now. Wild koalas are so dumb that if you give them a plate of said leaf they won't know what to do with it. They're cute, that's about it. If a babies only food source is its mother's fecal matter, something is wrong with your species. I also like panda bears, they aren't necessarily dumb, but come on pandas meet us half way there on this "reproduce or go extinct" thing.

[TheBlueMarvel]

Poor Koalas...they're still cute as all get out! lol

[CMIII]

we all say "Jason is an Idiot" but is he really.... For an Idiot he some how finds and attacks Alice and goes back to Crystal Lake in Friday 2. In Friday 4 he manages to get from a Morgue back to Crystal Lake granted he is eventually killed by Tommy. In Friday 5 he seems realize Tommy is a threat. In Jason goes to Hell (the most intelligent) he seems able to realize that he needs a Voorhees to reincarnate himself and he goes directly for his Sister, Niece, and Grandniece.

[En Sabah Nerd]

Quote:

Originally Posted by CMIII

we all say "Jason is an Idiot" but is he really.... For an Idiot he some how finds and attacks Alice and goes back to Crystal Lake in Friday 2. In Friday 4 he manages to get from a Morgue back to Crystal Lake granted he is eventually killed by Tommy. In Friday 5 he seems realize Tommy is a threat. In Jason goes to Hell (the most intelligent) he seems able to realize that he needs a Voorhees to reincarnate himself and he goes directly for his Sister, Niece, and Grandniece.

So he's like dog intelligent. Dogs have a remarkable sense of home finding (there's a lot of stories about dogs being lost and coming home up to years later), dogs are excellent at finding hidden things, they recognize and attack threats (if you bring them up to attack, otherwise they just bark and intimidate), and some dogs have a degree of familial recognition. Jason is as smart as a dog with murderous intent in a human body. Furthering the notion that if he decided to put on the Infinity Gauntlet he would probably just kill a lot of stuff.

[kylactus]

He's a savant, like a severely retarded kid that can play the piano at master level without training... but his piano is murder.

[jestermon]

Quote:

Originally Posted by CMIII

we all say "Jason is an Idiot" but is he really.... For an Idiot he some how finds and attacks Alice and goes back to Crystal Lake in Friday 2. In Friday 4 he manages to get from a Morgue back to Crystal Lake granted he is eventually killed by Tommy. In Friday 5 he seems realize Tommy is a threat. In Jason goes to Hell (the most intelligent) he seems able to realize that he needs a Voorhees to reincarnate himself and he goes directly for his Sister, Niece, and Grandniece.

In Jason X, he figures out how to stuff sleeping bags full of folk and beat the others with it.

I guess that's intelligent?

[IcantBseriouS]

This has been very fun to read. I have these exact types of conversations with my friend while drinking beer at my bonfires.